CAL + UAL more rumors?

[EMBpilot]

A friend of mine was an FO on a CAL flight carrying a FAA jumpseater the other day. I don't know if the jumpseater was on the CAL's POI team or what not, but at the end of a flight the told the guys:

"You'll be with United within a year. And I personally am working on it".

Has anyone heard any more? Just curious.

Also, I saw a CAL route map in Continental magazine and it shows I think 5 destination out of LAX - any more serious talk about the LA base?

 

[Tanner]

Yes.....next year after the merger.

 

[densoo]

A friend of mine was an FO on a CAL flight carrying a FAA jumpseater the other day. I don't know if the jumpseater was on the CAL's POI team or what not, but at the end of a flight the told the guys:

"You'll be with United within a year. And I personally am working on it".

Has anyone heard any more? Just curious.

Also, I saw a CAL route map in Continental magazine and it shows I think 5 destination out of LAX - any more serious talk about the LA base?

I flew with someone last Tuesday who said they heard CAL had announced a DAL purchase that day very day. Now CAL and UAL. Rumors all.

The CAL route map includes Expressjets operating for CAL. That's what's flying out of LAX I believe.

 

[Hutchman]

I flew with someone last Tuesday who said they heard CAL had announced a DAL purchase that day very day. Now CAL and UAL. Rumors all.

The CAL route map includes Expressjets operating for CAL. That's what's flying out of LAX I believe.

LAX to -EWR
IAH
CLE
HNL
RJ's to Mexico, 4 I think???

 

[Hutchman]

I flew with someone last Tuesday who said they heard CAL had announced a DAL purchase that day very day. Now CAL and UAL. Rumors all.

A United Captain had a tech ops guy jumpseating on his flight. He said the A-320 was missing it's fuel consumption #'s. He said a very large 737 NG order is comming as a replacement for the A-320. If that actually happens, the fleet types look similar.


"We all know that eventually something will happen to someone.................."
-Unknown

 

[IAHERJ]

I spoke wo our CEO today briefly at the training center. He, of course made no mention of it. If this FAA guy did say what was claimed he said, he'd be in big trouble.

IAHERJ

 

[ATRedneck]

LAX to -EWR
IAH
CLE
HNL
RJ's to Mexico, 4 I think???

LAX-OGG also.

 

[Spectre]

A friend of mine was an FO on a CAL flight carrying a FAA jumpseater the other day. I don't know if the jumpseater was on the CAL's POI team or what not, but at the end of a flight the told the guys:

"You'll be with United within a year. And I personally am working on it".

Has anyone heard any more? Just curious.

Also, I saw a CAL route map in Continental magazine and it shows I think 5 destination out of LAX - any more serious talk about the LA base?

I believe NWAC has voting rights on any merger with CAL. Don't think they'd approve it. This agreement runs out after the year 2020ish. CAL might be able to buy another airline to get around this agreement.

 

[Jonny Sacko]

I believe NWAC has voting rights on any merger with CAL. Don't think they'd approve it. This agreement runs out after the year 2020ish. CAL might be able to buy another airline to get around this agreement.

Not true again.

 

[NuGuy]

Not true again.

Actually, its very true...as part of the DOJ settlement where NWA sold most of their CAL stock, NWA was allowed to retain a "golden share" that allows them to veto most corporate transactions, including mergers and outright sales.

I'm not saying it couldn't happen, but the only way NWA would allow it is if there were big $$$$ exchanged in consideration.

Nu

 

[320AV8R]

Actually, its very true...as part of the DOJ settlement where NWA sold most of their CAL stock, NWA was allowed to retain a "golden share" that allows them to veto most corporate transactions, including mergers and outright sales.

I'm not saying it couldn't happen, but the only way NWA would allow it is if there were big $$$$ exchanged in consideration.

Nu

NU IS TRUE.

NWA must be consulted before CAL can merge with anyone. (More $$$$$ in Wilson's pocket!!)

It will be reeeeeal interesting when DAL & NWA come outta CH 11.

 

[catIIIc]

My guess is CAL and NWA will merge and they will stay seperate just like Air France and KLM, or nothing will happen or something no one has even talked about will happen. One thing is for sure if you have heard it before it probably will not come to fruition. I know when AA came in and bought TWA we had no clue that was going to happen until it was announced on CNBC.

 

[ESS PWR]

The DOJ statute requiring anti-trust oversight, will not provide veto power to a corporation that will prevent a competitor from growing. Consistent with the statute, in order to allow business partnership protection, the DOJ permitted NW carry a "golden share" in order to protect a business venture. However, the DOJ also indicated CAL can proceed with any acquisition transaction without consulting NW or any business partner. It also provided CAL the latitude to use common stock for any corporate acquisition. That "golden share" expires in 2025.

 

[SWA/FO]

What would some FAA "safety inspector" be working on (merger wise) anyway?

 

[pkober]

My brothers, best friends uncles dog walkers sisters old serority sisters brother in law told me that we are going to buy Aeroflot. It will be called Flotinental, or maybe ContiAero or Contiflot. I can't remember what he said.

Airline rumors, you gotta love em.

CLAMBAKE

 

[frog_flyer]

but i heard the mx guys from aeroflot were headed to GIA. Serves em right!

aeroflot hasnt gone a year without crashing in 4 decades!

 

[Getter]

Just heard yesterday that CAL will be merging with Alaska. You go CAL!!

 

[seahorse]

If CAL merges with Northwest, can we set up some type of fence so that the CAL pilots don't have to fly with those nasty Northwest flight attendants. Maybe they can implement that into PBS - "Avoid NWA FA" LOL

 

[Batplane]

Well, I see CAL's plan for World domination seem to be on track.

 

[Tim47SIP]

Delta's FA's!

You obviously haven't been on a Delta flight lately, have you?:smash:

 

[pkober]

CAL + Alaska = Contilaska or Alasnental or Contka or ALCAL

 

[Patriot328]

Could be CAL and Aer Lingus..

"conilingus" (close enough)

 

[Ex737Driver]

Just heard yesterday that CAL will be merging with Alaska. You go CAL!!

Actually that has been some of the latest talk from a few of the gentlemen doing the pilot interviews in EWR. Several reasons are quite apparent and obvious; (1) Kellner has said on several occasions that CAL NEEDS a west coast hub. Alaska dominates SEA, PDX, ANC, with residual flying out of LAX. Add that to CAL's flying out of LAX and now you have a west coast presence with room to grow. (2) CAL's international feed from Europe, South America, and Asia will allow Alaska substantial new revenue. (3) With the removal of Alaska's MD-80's, both fleet types will be 100% compatible. (4) There are only a few overlaps in both route structures. (5) Adding both the Alaksa and CAL pilot groups together will produce an airline the approximate size of UAL which eliminates the need for a merger with UAL should NWA and DAL merge. (6) Because of Alaska's poison pill clause, this will not be a buyout but a carefully planned merger with both parties complete consent. (7) Last, both airlines are in positions for revenue growth which will bring both shareholder groups on board whereas a UAL merger would stiffle revenue or possibly eliminate it altogether.

 

[Hutchman]

Actually that has been some of the latest talk from a few of the gentlemen doing the pilot interviews in EWR. Several reasons are quite apparent and obvious; (1) Kellner has said on several occasions that CAL NEEDS a west coast hub. Alaska dominates SEA, PDX, ANC, with residual flying out of LAX. Add that to CAL's flying out of LAX and now you have a west coast presence with room to grow. (2) CAL's international feed from Europe, South America, and Asia will allow Alaska substantial new revenue. (3) With the removal of Alaska's MD-80's, both fleet types will be 100% compatible. (4) There are only a few overlaps in both route structures. (5) Adding both the Alaksa and CAL pilot groups together will produce an airline the approximate size of UAL which eliminates the need for a merger with UAL should NWA and DAL merge. (6) Because of Alaska's poison pill clause, this will not be a buyout but a carefully planned merger with both parties complete consent. (7) Last, both airlines are in positions for revenue growth which will bring both shareholder groups on board whereas a UAL merger would stiffle revenue or possibly eliminate it altogether.

Did they also say that given the current price of Alaska shares a buyout is highly unlikely. Alaska is too expensive to buy right now.

 

[Ex737Driver]

Did they also say that given the current price of Alaska shares a buyout is highly unlikely. Alaska is too expensive to buy right now.

(6) Because of Alaska's poison pill clause, this will not be a buyout but a carefully planned merger with both parties complete consent.

Missed that little tidbit, huh?

 

[ESS PWR]

Did they also say that given the current price of Alaska shares a buyout is highly unlikely. Alaska is too expensive to buy right now.

Not to support the view of the current thread, but share price has little if any impact. As of 7-14, ALK market cap is 1.14B. In other words, if your outstanding shares are worth $200 in the open market, but you only have 1 million outstanding shares, your market cap is then $200 million.

LUV has nearly 300 million outstanding shares, which affords very little price fluctuation, but generally makes it a poor return investment.

 

[Marko Ramius]

???

A United Captain had a tech ops guy jumpseating on his flight. He said the A-320 was missing it's fuel consumption #'s. He said a very large 737 NG order is comming as a replacement for the A-320. If that actually happens, the fleet types look similar.


"We all know that eventually something will happen to someone.................."
-Unknown

Ua has @ 100 319/320's, if the fuel thing was really a concern wouldn't it be way cheaper to add those winglets that are being tested right now and push IAE for some enhancements to drop the SFC's a little?

 

[320AV8R]

The DOJ statute requiring anti-trust oversight, will not provide veto power to a corporation that will prevent a competitor from growing. Consistent with the statute, in order to allow business partnership protection, the DOJ permitted NW carry a "golden share" in order to protect a business venture. However, the DOJ also indicated CAL can proceed with any acquisition transaction without consulting NW or any business partner. It also provided CAL the latitude to use common stock for any corporate acquisition. That "golden share" expires in 2025.

NWA owns no Common shares of CAL. They don't own the Preferred shares, either. Those were sold back to CAL in September, 1998. As a condition of the transaction, CAL signed a 25 year agreement that gives NWA veto rights over 6 specific actions by the CAL BOD. Among them is the the right to merge with another airline.

 

[ESS PWR]

NWA owns no Common shares of CAL. They don't own the Preferred shares, either. Those were sold back to CAL in September, 1998. As a condition of the transaction, CAL signed a 25 year agreement that gives NWA veto rights over 6 specific actions by the CAL BOD. Among them is the the right to merge with another airline.

You are correct in that NW does not, nor has it ever owned B class shares. In 1998, NW acquired A class shares from TPG. NW currently has one (1) so called super voting share, that allows it to protect a partnership agreement.

However, the DOJ has never allowed (anti-trust), and this case (2002) is no different, a competitor restrict a business transaction where the use of common stock is involved in an acquisition.

In plain english, NW does not have veto power or any saying whatsoever, if CAL decides to acquire another airline or business entity. NW's golden share comes into play, should a takeover of CAL be attempted, with limited veto power in an effort to protect a partnership, and I refer to limited because the DOJ can still overturn citing antitrust issues. While NW did not value that "golden share" in its assets during BK filing, some experts value it from 50-250 millions due to good liquidity and asset base at CAL.

This, off course, is great for CAL because it forces them to be a potential investor, rather than a target for a takeover. It is still a good deal for NW since it provides a revenue stream.

 

[Ex737Driver]

Not to support the view of the current thread, but share price has little if any impact. As of 7-14, ALK market cap is 1.14B. In other words, if your outstanding shares are worth $200 in the open market, but you only have 1 million outstanding shares, your market cap is then $200 million.

LUV has nearly 300 million outstanding shares, which affords very little price fluctuation, but generally makes it a poor return investment.

Exactly. Whether you believe the recent development with Alaska or not, I think the chance of a UAL-CAL merger is far below that of a ALK-CAL merger.