Being a CFI = Competitive

[BoDEAN]

Who knew, lol.

We have 2 instructors leaving, and me being a logical thinker, thought that we would either put their students in a hat, or split them down the middle for the 3 of us that are left. Seems that the split was 10%/10%/80% and I am one of the 10%'ers. The head guy choose to take 80%.

Makes my stomach turn. I guess all is not fair in this world we live in, oh well. Jus thought I would vent....my apologies


Anyways, so how is your day going? hehe

 

[nosehair]

Logical Thinking = Disappointing Expecta

Logical, straight-line, factual reasoning is probably one of the reasons we like to fly. There are risks, but we can use deductive reasoning with known variables to reasonably calculate an outcome.
But throw in the Human Factor (emotion, politics, religion, personal ego) and no one, repeat, no one can logically deduce the outcome. You will go mad trying.

 

[Timebuilder]

You have just experienced one of the truths of life. It isn't fair.

I had thought, before I started flying (the second time, without my father) that the aviation business was populated by people that my dad knew, the WWII guys, the ones that usually conducted themselves as officers and gentlemen. I no doubt carried this assumption forward from my youth, when such people were typical, not unusual.

What I found, ever increasingly, is that aviation now largely reflects popular cultural views of relativism and cutthroat human nature. Rather than finding a group of exceptions, I found a large group of norms.

You are not the only CFI to be on the short end of a stick.
Before I was hired, I was told that a new CFI would be needed right away, and I expressed that I was interested in being that go-to guy, stepping into the shoes left behind by my own instructor, who had moved on to his first charter job. I worked diligently, and made certainthat I aced the CFI test process, a 98 on the written and kudos on the practical from the fed who was my examiner. That fed now teaches DPE courses at OKC.

That same week I passed my tests, I saw a new face around the school. Turns out this new kid had been to ERAU, and the secretary started assigning almost every new student to him. I was asked to teach the affiliated college course on instrument flight, so I had a lot to do, and let it pass. After a couple of months of not seeing new students, I asked the boss about it. He told me that he was "unaware" of this, and said he would move to stop it. Perhaps coincidentally, this new face moved on, and the secretary started assigning students to another new guy, one who had passed his tests within days of me. He instructed for about three months or so, and left for a corporate flight department.

The secretary problem finally got fixed (she eventually went to another job, during which time it became appparent that she suffered some real emotional problems, like faking a pregnancy) and I started to pick up a good student load.

The next month was September, 2001.

So, Bodean, it was my mistake to begin with to assume that folks in avitaion conduct themselves in any way that speaks to the risk and responsibility of flying airplanes, or that ideas like fairness and comraderie are any more likely to be found near a hangar than they are to be found in the offices of Tyco.

Sure, there are good people running flight schools. I just don't hear of much fairness or respect at most places. Maybe it's because everyone is so eager to get along the path and head off to that big airline job. Maybe it's because things like honor are not emphasized in schools. Maybe it's because we are seen as interchangeable parts, with few options and a ridgid dynamic to fit into.

So, watch you back, and like Ceasar, "beware the ides of March."

 

[bobbysamd]

Welcome to aviation - and life

We have 2 instructors leaving, and me being a logical thinker, thought that we would either put their students in a hat, or split them down the middle for the 3 of us that are left. Seems that the split was 10%/10%/80% and I am one of the 10%'ers. The head guy choose to take 80%.

So much for logic.

Of course, you know the Golden Rule: "He who has the Gold makes the Rules."

I don't have much patience for that kind of crap anymore. Something like what happened to you would have me firing off more resumes that I had been. Good luck with your future plans.

I second Timebuilder, who also grew up in the college of hard knocks called Radio, that life, indeed, is not fair. My favorite there is being hired for a particular shift but eventually being put on the lousy shifts because other newsroom members were married and I was single.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

just show you are a better instructor.

Potential students see this and will flock your way.

Dont worry about him, worry about yourself.

 

[BoDEAN]

Hey, thanks! Brought a smile to my face reading the posts!
Appreciate it!

 

[Timebuilder]

My favorite there is being hired for a particular shift but eventually being put on the lousy shifts because other newsroom members were married and I was single.

My favorite was when I hyped a young blonde DJ that I had worked with previously to my boss, and he hired her and gave her middays, and she gave me nada.

Potential students see this and will flock your way.

I disagree. Students who have not flown with you have little idea of your worth as an instructor, since, at most schools, there is little contact between students. They arrive, they fly, and they leave. An ERAU, a Comair, or some other school that has a social structure would be the exception.

 

[labbats]

Actually, they will notice. Students talk about instructors like a knitting circle talks about gossip. A good instructor is obvious to them, and when their instructor is booked, will often ask to fly with you. Especially if you make learning fun instead of the chore I see so often.

 

[flyifrvfr]

I know this type of stuff goes on at every profession. Some people seem like they have a golden horseshoe up thier @ss. I worked for years as a tractor trailer driver and had been issued routes and trucks nobody would take. I learned quickly that no matter how well you do your job, if your dispatcher or boss didn't like you, your time there would be miserable.

I earned my CFI in march of this year and I am still unemployed. I have submitted resumes to every local school and many have told me to keep in touch. I was told by a chief CFI that he would hire me in a month and that was three weeks ago. I called him and he told me it would be longer now because he gave his part timers new students. This must be the only industry where you don't have to work full time and still take work away from someone who wants to work full time.

I told one flight school about this who knows I would want full time work. I told them that if this is how the industry works then call me a part timer and I will, when not flying, hang around and try to get more students. I will be here 10 hours per day, but you can call me a part timer if it helps me to get the job.

 

[JediNein]

A good instructor is obvious to them, and when their instructor is booked, will often ask to fly with you.

And then the other instructors will complain to your boss about you sharking their students. Hey guys, I don't control another person's behavior, the students chose of their own free will.

It got to be a problem, so I left the school. So did the students.

I've never wondered why the school and the certain instructors have neglected me on their Christmas mailing list for the last several years.

Fly SAFE!
Jedi Nein

 

[Timebuilder]

Actually, they will notice. Students talk about instructors like a knitting circle talks about gossip. A good instructor is obvious to them, and when their instructor is booked, will often ask to fly with you. Especially if you make learning fun instead of the chore I see so often.

Okay, I'll bite.

How does one student, in his car and driving away, talk with another student who is preflighting the aircraft?

Are you talking about a school where all of the students hang around one location all day, such as at Comair? That's the only situation I can imagine where this kind of scuttlebutt can be shared.

 

[Jedi_Cheese]

Okay, I'll bite.

How does one student, in his car and driving away, talk with another student who is preflighting the aircraft?

Are you talking about a school where all of the students hang around one location all day, such as at Comair? That's the only situation I can imagine where this kind of scuttlebutt can be shared.

Do the CFIs escort the students everywhere on the airport property? Have you ever told a student to go check the weather and then found them chatting with another pilot at the weather machine? How about them just chatting while filling out paperwork, waiting for you to get done with your previous student, or picking up new charts?

You are booked solid this week and thus they try a lesson with CFI Smith and Jones. You essentially just interviewed for your job in the student's eyes. They now have to decide if it is now worth the potential of pissing you off to switch to this 'better' instructor?

 

[CDVdriver]

Back to the original post.
Any reason given for this 10/10/80 split?
Private students, Instrument or Commercial?
Just to state the blatently obvious if you don't have your CFII the IR guys will go to somebody else,if you've never done a Commercial and there 's some time pressure you won't get 'em either meaning somebody else gets "all" the students.
Without a little more info this situation is difficult to judge.
If the're all PPL's you've been stiffed mate.........

 

[Timebuilder]

Do the CFIs escort the students everywhere on the airport property? Have you ever told a student to go check the weather and then found them chatting with another pilot at the weather machine? How about them just chatting while filling out paperwork, waiting for you to get done with your previous student, or picking up new charts?

You are booked solid this week and thus they try a lesson with CFI Smith and Jones. You essentially just interviewed for your job in the student's eyes. They now have to decide if it is now worth the potential of pissing you off to switch to this 'better' instructor?

I think you are missing my point. What I am saying is this: 99 times out of 100, there was a student already doing his preflight as I was inside wrapping up the previous lesson. Someone else was already in the practice area with another student. One had cancelled, and his instructor had gone to the bank. Students were not able to have much contact, unless they attended an organized ground school.

Looking at your second paragraph, it sounds like a large school with many instructors and students, not a situation like Bodean or I am referencing. Even so, students can only share anecdotal info and opinions. If that's what you mean by choosing the "best" instructor, that's fine. In the student's mind, the "best" instructor may be simply the person they like more. You and I both know that a student has zero idea of who is actually the "best instructor."

I think you mean "favorite" instructor.

 

[Jedi_Cheese]

If you think that a student can't tell if the CFI is good or not, you are wrong. I had a sneaking suspicion that I got set up with new CFIs when I did my private. I later found out that I was correct.

My first CFI had 300 hrs (no CFII or MEI) when I started training and he knew his stuff, but when you asked why something happened, he would have to think about it. I then left town for 9 months (college) and when I returned, he was an exelent CFI to work with. All my complaints about him the first time we flew had been solved. I want to do my complex/high performance/tailwheel/aerobatic with him this summer if possible.

You are correct that I have only flown out of busier training FBO's. I know of at least 2 students that picked their CFI's based on refrences from other students and one of them flew out of a FBO like the one you described.

 

[Timebuilder]

If you think that a student can't tell if the CFI is good or not, you are wrong. I had a sneaking suspicion that I got set up with new CFIs when I did my private. I later found out that I was correct.

I think this just means that you were an excellent student.

The other side of this coin is, of course, that the CFI was not fully trained and tested before his check ride. More than likely, his status was like that old observation about medical schools: what do you call the guy who graduates last in his class at medical school? Answer: "Doctor." Like the instructor you mentioned, he would hopefully continue to improve with practice and guidance from others.

All I'm saying is that some students may decide they like flying with a particular instructor, or are guided to one by friends, at a busy school like you mentioned. Whether they are able to determine if an instructor is "good" is not an ability that most students would share. A few top end, highly motivated students such as yourself may have an inkling, true.

 

[350DRIVER]

I would not let this bother you, politics are extremely evident in the instructing market, 135 & 91 departments. It has been this way for years and it is a "good ole boy" network in more ways than one. As many can tell ya, "it isn't what you know or do it IS who you know". Learn early on not to take things personally in this business, it happens a lot and you will see that as you move up the ranks.



it is just a "game", keep the odds in your favor and don't burn any bridges that can come back to haunt you.


good luck,

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