ATP required for type rating

[Diesel]

Have a bet with a case of beer on the line.....

If you have a commercial liscence and go for a type rating in a bandit for a cargo company do you need your atp?

Basically can you get a type without an atp? If it is possible are there any restrictions on the operation?

Thanks.

 

[FalconPilot69]

Here is one answer.

You do not have to have an atp if you are not flying for hire. You can go to your local FSDO and get a letter of authorization to operate whatever the aircraft is that you need a type in. You will however have to be able to pass a checkride like a 135 PIC ride or an ATP ride. If you are flying for hire, you must have an ATP and a type, if your aircraft is a turbo jet or an aircraft operating above 12,500 lbs.

For those that might want to say that I am full of it, here is the case in point. John Travolta has a type rating in the BBJ, Lear 25 and I believe a 737. He is however, only a private pilot with an instrument rating.

I hope this helps.

 

[JetBlast2000]

You owe me beer now!

Scheduled 135 with people ----yes ATP (cape AIr)
Non-scheduled 135 no atp (pax or not)
121 Captain yes!

 

[Diesel]

I'm still want to check with the fsdo.

This wouldn't be such a problem if my buddy wasn't lazy and had his atp.

PS scheduled 135 at cape air no type for the 402.

So the question still is:

Type rating required 135 cargo atp?

 

[Buckeye]

No you do not have to have an ATP to be typed in an aircraft that is on 135 Freight. At the company I flew DC-3's for you only needed you Commercial License, they had a max takeoff weight of 26,900lbs.

 

[TonyC]

Re: Here is one answer.

John Travolta has a type rating in the BBJ, Lear 25 and I believe a 737. He is however, only a private pilot with an instrument rating.

This from the FAA Registry :

JOHN JOSEPH TRAVOLTA
Address

Street 15821 VENTURA BLVD STE 460

City ENCINO State CALIFORNIA
County LOS ANGELES Zip Code 91436-4778
Country UNITED STATES




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Medical


Medical Class : First Medical Date: 05/2003




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Certificates

1 of 1






DOI : 09/04/2003
Certificate: PRIVATE PILOT

Rating(s):

PRIVATE PILOT
AIRPLANE SINGLE ENGINE LAND
AIRPLANE MULTIENGINE LAND
INSTRUMENT AIRPLANE









Type Ratings


P/CE-500 P/G-1159 P/HS-125 P/LR-JET




Limits


CE-500 (VFR ONLY).



Funny thing is, I assumed he was typed in his personal 707. (I wonder if they know he lives in Anthony, FL now?)

 

[d.fitz]

Any type rating checkride is also an ATP ride. So he will get it then anyway...

My first type I did not have the mins for ATP so I just got the type - I was flying part 91

The second I got the ATP - no difference in the checkride (at FSI anyway)


Bottom line - he should not have to get an ATP prior to the checkride...

 

[SquirrelDog]

Dude!!!

Do you have to post this question on all the different forums?
NOTE: see answers on GENERAL

 

[Diesel]

actually i do. As you can see there are a ton of different answers.

Plus it's a CASE of beer. Not just a beer.

If you don't lik it don't read it.

 

[TonyC]

However, ...

actually i do. As you can see there are a ton of different answers.

Do you want a "ton of different answers" or just the right one?

 

[Diesel]

Actually just the correct one as seen by the feds. The right one would mean that I want the one that gives me the beer.

 

[Xfr8dog]

HAHA!

Let NOONE bust this guys chops! He's staying focused on whats important... lets do the same

 

[cruxx@9]

Well do we get some of that beer if we help you out?

Like many have said you do not need an ATP to get a type and fly freight Part 135. But it is the same checkride so why not just spend a weekend at All ATP or one of those places and pass the written then get a first class medical so you can take get your ATP at the same time, no need for another checkride. If you already have an ATP it is just an add on type rating. I got my ATP with my type but I was too young only 21. I had all the other requirements but I could not use the privileges until I turned 23. I could fly the jet as PIC but could only carry freight, basically I had a commercial type for 18 months.

So where we going to drink that case?

Keep 'em in the green.

 

[B190Captain]

Re: Re: Here is one answer.

This from the FAA Registry :

JOHN JOSEPH TRAVOLTA
Address

Street 15821 VENTURA BLVD STE 460

City ENCINO State CALIFORNIA
County LOS ANGELES Zip Code 91436-4778
Country UNITED STATES

Medical

Medical Class : First Medical Date: 05/2003

Certificates

1 of 1

DOI : 09/04/2003
Certificate: PRIVATE PILOT

Rating(s):

PRIVATE PILOT
AIRPLANE SINGLE ENGINE LAND
AIRPLANE MULTIENGINE LAND
INSTRUMENT AIRPLANE

Type Ratings


P/CE-500 P/G-1159 P/HS-125 P/LR-JET

Limits
CE-500 (VFR ONLY).

Funny thing is, I assumed he was typed in his personal 707. (I wonder if they know he lives in Anthony, FL now?)

I don't think that is the right Travolta or maybe the info has not been updated since he is a celebrity.

Travolta is also type rated in a 747 and the 707. Celebrity or not, to fly a turbojet aircraft no matter what size requires a type rating.

He got the 747 type when he asked the CEO of Quantas to represent them by painting his 707 in Quantas colors in his "friendship" tour around the world. The CEO made him an honorary Captain provided he got typed in the 747.

 

[TonyC]

Re: Re: Re: Here is one answer.

I don't think that is the right Travolta or maybe the info has not been updated since he is a celebrity.

Travolta is also type rated in a 747 and the 707. Celebrity or not, to fly a turbojet aircraft no matter what size requires a type rating.

You'll notice the DOI (Date of Issuance) is 9/04/03, just a little over 3 months ago. I don't think the FAA has any special programs for secreting celebrities' certificates, although I could very well be wrong.

Certainly a PIC of a 707 or 747 would require a type rating in same, but a type is not required to fly SIC, or even to sit in the left seat and receive instruction from a properly qualified instructor. How many FOs have type ratings in DC-10's or 727's or... name another turbojet.

Perhaps we should sic the National Enquirer on an investigation.

EDIT:

Call off the Enquirer - - I found the official website. His name IS John Joseph Travolta, and he's not typed in the 707.

John Travolta Aviation

Audiences may know that John Travolta played an Air Force major piloting a Stealth Bomber in BROKEN ARROW , that he narrated a 50th Anniversary documentary on The Blue Angels and named his son Jett. But many may not know that he is a licensed jet pilot with a life long passion for aviation. Since earning his wings in 1974, John has logged close to an astounding 5,000 flying hours.

"Every cent of my first paychecks went to flying lessons," recalls Travolta, who has trained in cockpits as diverse as his acting roles. They include qualifying as a captain in the Gulfstream II, Lear 24, hawker 1A, Citation 1 and 2, Tebuan and Vampire Jet. He has qualified as first officer in the Boeing 707. Travolta keeps his skill up-to-date through continual refresher courses, training at American Airlines, Pan Am, Semiflite an other institutions.

Travolta first became enamored of aviation as a child, at the same time he developed a love of acting. His mother and sisters were stage performers and he regularly saw them off at the airport. He observed the flight paths of the nearest airports, read books on aviation, and took special interest in Constellations, DC-6s and DC-7s. Attesting to his early charisma, he persuaded the girls in his neighborhood to don their Brownie uniforms to play flight attendants as he "captained" his backyard airliner.

"I find flying extroverting -- it puts your attention outside yourself -- you're responsible for a machine that is going through the air at 600mph. The sensation is thrilling and there is a beauty and an art to it." says Travolta.

The actor is accompanied by two other captains, flight attendants and an engineer on his own transoceanic flights.

While John Travolta doesn't appear to be limiting his film career in any way, he has often said he would like become involved with a major airline in some way. That goal was realized in 2002, when he participated in the Qantas "Spirit of Friendship" tour, piloting his own Boeing 707 on a thirteen city, 35,000 mile tour. He continues as Ambassador-at-Large for the Australia based Qantas.

 

[B190Captain]

As for the type rating requirement, I meant to say to serve as PIC in a turbojet requires a type.


On all the other stuff, I stand corrected. Thanks for the info Tony.


Strange...

 

[upndsky]

As for the B-747 type, he went through the Qantas B-747 training program but I don't know if he got the full package or if they just let him play in the sim for a few hours. Then to get the type, he would have to have an Australian pilot's license. A type on that wouldn't show up on the FAA registery. And to be named an honorary captain is as useful as getting an honorary doctorate degree for speaking at some college's graduation.

 

[GoSpurs]

Have a bet with a case of beer on the line.....

If you have a commercial liscence and go for a type rating in a bandit for a cargo company do you need your atp?

Basically can you get a type without an atp? If it is possible are there any restrictions on the operation?

Thanks.

No you don't need an ATP to get a Type, but.. To fly as PIC on a turbine powerd aircraft that requires two pilots on a 135 charter you do have to have the ATP. Cago, or Pass. it doesn't matter. The FAA is reviewing the REG because it contradicts another reg. But for now they are making it stick.



§ 135.4

(a) An "eligible on-demand operation" is an on-demand operation conducted under this part that meets the following requirements:

(1) Two-pilot crew. The flightcrew must consist of at least two qualified pilots employed or contracted by the certificate holder.

(2) Flight crew experience. The crewmembers must have met the applicable requirements of part 61 of this chapter and have the following experience and ratings:

(i) Total flight time for all pilots:

(A) Pilot in command -- A minimum of 1,500 hours.

(B) Second in command -- A minimum of 500 hours.

(ii) For multi-engine turbine-powered fixed-wing and powered-lift aircraft, the following FAA certification and ratings requirements:

(A) Pilot in command -- Airline transport pilot and applicable type ratings.

(B) Second in command -- Commercial pilot and instrument ratings.