ASA- Are you prepared to walk away?

[av8er2]

If ASA trys to devalue our skills and pay us nothing, how many of you are ready to just do something else?

I will not start over at the bottom of another airline and BL and ASA need to realize a lot of us won't do that. I think many of us will just leave and get another job with our college educations. Not flying an airplane is not the end of the world.

Give us a fair contract for our valuable skills or I am walking away doing something else.

How many of you feel the same way?

 

[Vladimir Lenin]

there shall always be a steady supply of 600 and 1, sjs inflicted retards

raise the mins to 135 ifr, cut the loans and require a 4 year degree

 

[miles otoole]

there shall always be a steady supply of 600 and 1, sjs inflicted retards

raise the mins to 135 ifr, cut the loans and require a 4 year degree

Why? Many of these pilots who haven't met these requirements are probably more qualified than you are.

 

[79%N1]

Yea, its not the end of the world. This job is really getting to the point where it is not worth it, especially if ASA experiences more stagnation. One can only go on trying to make a living on $30,000/yr for so long, and under such crappy work rules and labor/management unrest.

One thing I want to know, all these guys say it is so easy to get another job, but.....where? There arent really as many good paying jobs with good benefits there as you think. I know, Home Depot is what everyone says. But, are we all going to work there?

Anyway, I dont want to be part of the continued race to the bottom....

Hey.......where has the General been? Have my prayers been answered and his computer finally broke? One can dream.

 

[Vladimir Lenin]

Why? Many of these pilots who haven't met these requirements are probably more qualified than you are.

did i strike a nerve, tool?

 

[scarlet]

I vote yes--READY to walk-for my 30,000 I can work in my friends rest. for that. or actually go back to driving buses for even a little more money

I vote we walk... and trash ASA on the way out--make it where it was not a good buy for Skywest...I don't know how the doors broke on the o2 mask, I don't know how that Tube got busted....???????????????????????????????????

 

["GO AROUND"]

Willing to walk? Yes. Away from aviation? Hoping it doesn't come to that. Am exploring other options.

I havn't heard managment speaking up to take a cut or anything else they expect from us. I'm not gonna be the only one to help keep us in the cost box they put us in. I have been taking a pay cut for 3 yrs and they say that the pilot costs have grown above what is acceptable. BS!

 

[MarineGrunt]

...make it where it was not a good buy for Skywest...

Oh, you bet! Make sure you F your buddy on the way out the door too jackass.

 

[av8er2]

There are jobs out there that we can make $30,000. Take a loan out and get a masters, I try to think positive, and I think there are options out there.

This is easy to say if you live within your means, the Delta guys are finding out what happens with paycuts and living outside your means.

You can only hire low time pilots so long before an accident happens! If the experience walks and they hire a bunch of low time pilots it will only take a few accidents to put ASA out of business.

The low time guys fly the aircraft well, but flying the aircraft is only a small part of the job!

 

[Dave Benjamin]

I vote we walk... and trash ASA on the way out--make it where it was not a good buy for Skywest...I don't know how the doors broke on the o2 mask, I don't know how that Tube got busted....???????????????????????????????????

Spoken like a true adolescent punk.
You want to walk - walk. You want to strike - strike. We can respect that. Vandalize aircraft? Wrong answer.
And if by chance someone rolls over on you perhaps you'll pick up a criminal record. Might make your future job hunt real interesting.

 

[ohplease!]

There are jobs out there that we can make $30,000. Take a loan out and get a masters, I try to think positive, and I think there are options out there.

This is easy to say if you live within your means, the Delta guys are finding out what happens with paycuts and living outside your means.

You can only hire low time pilots so long before an accident happens! If the experience walks and they hire a bunch of low time pilots it will only take a few accidents to put ASA out of business.

The low time guys fly the aircraft well, but flying the aircraft is only a small part of the job!

what about those of us who've paid our "dues" to get to 70k or 80k Plus? Do we just walk away and work for Home Depot for 30k?

 

[Gulfstream 200]

these are the same guys who had little stiffys the first day of jet airplane ground school just a few years back...even though they were being paid 12 bucks an hour.

a couple years later its just -- unacceptable.

step out of the way boys, let the next fool in the door!

 

[BenderGonzales]

Lot of unity there OhPlease. Way to go. Your attitude towards newhire F/Os is pretty transparent.

 

[WSurf]

That sums up the industry and why we are going down the sh$ter!!! 'It's all about me'!!! And management has used the pilots greed against himself!! And we are so dumb to realize it!!!

 

[ohplease!]

Lot of unity there OhPlease. Way to go. Your attitude towards newhire F/Os is pretty transparent.

what about newhire attitudes towards us? Thats all I hear is about "burning it down" (kills me every time I hear that.) because nobody can earn more than 30k...well, lots of us earn more and have plenty of time off.

Truth is, NOBODY is out for anyone but themselves! If you can help me by getting what you want, you'd be glad to. If you can get what you want but it screws me, you'll do it. You'll say your all about the '"team" but, thats BS.

If we can negotiate something better for all of us, great! But don't think for a minute I'm gonna walk out on my career just to bring up new hire pay. Its low EVERYWHERE! EVERYWHERE! I prefer to look long term and hope for whats best for us all in the long term. Scheduling, duty rigs, growth, etc.

 

[BenderGonzales]

Oh, I dont work there. I just think what you said made you sound like a tool. Have a nice day though.

 

[~~~^~~~]

Yes, I am ready to walk away from ASA forever. I'm already employed at my next job (part time), which has a very nice fleet of airplanes we use for Corporate travel. We will be in a position to hire at least a couple of ASA's pilots and help them out. However, I hope it does not come to that.

At ASA we are so much better off than what the pilots at Comair. Delta, as a result of its bankruptcy, has put Comair in a truly horrible situation. Delta may dump leases, which get picked up by outfits like Mesa for 50 cents on the dollar, yet the Comair pilots are going to be forced to compete, or lose the airline. SkyWest has secured flying for SkyWest and ASA by paying Delta money that Delta desperately needed. I appreciate that, but management has not capitalized on that fact (perhaps because we pilots just are not percieved as being "part of the team")

We are in a better negotiating position at ASA than Comair is, but not much. I think the ASA pilots are realistic about the economic side of the contract, but we really do need improvements in our work rules to get the Company to schedule us safely and efficiently. Also, in this competitive environment, we must have perfectly solid scope, merger and fragmentation language.

I'm sure the heat is turned up on our management, but Mr. Atkin has to present some assurance of good faith - which has not been forthcoming.

Beating the ASA pilot group into submission will not work without a whole lot of collateral damage to ASA and SkyWest. I think we know what the result is going to be - we can get there the easy way, or the hard way. Either way is up to management. Because yes, we are ready and willing to strike.

If it happens, I will be doing my best to offer positions to ASA pilots at my Company.

 

[probablecause]

READY, WILLING AND ABLE TO WALK AWAY!
[FONT=&quot]Personal sticking points for me are Retro Pay, Commuter Clause, Reserve Hierarchy, Integration, Reserve Scheduling, and NO PAY CUTS![/FONT]

 

[MXAV8R]

ohplease! you are such a Tool!! I have seen you in the crew room and know what you look like. I will be sure to point you out to the rest of the ASA pilots.

Strike Vote-YES

 

[puddlejumper101]

I wonder how true the rumor of LeBarbeque's job being on the line if the contract is not resolved in 90 days...The way I see it a good contract sucks (we shrink)...a bad contract sucks ( this place will suck more)...no contract we strike (ASA ends its existance)...for some reason everywhere I look right now I see nothing but suckiness...and bad management to go along with it...and the thing that makes me mad is the things we are asking for as a pilot group are all QOL issues that don't cost the company crap...One Team One Vision...my @$$...how does Herb Kelleher run such a good operation and no one chooses to emulate his example is beyond me. I hope this 90 day deadline comes and goes with no contract...and I hope LeBarbeque really does get canned for not getting the job done. The way I see it that ridiculous joke of a proposal the company put out will not be fixed in 90 days...so the best thing that can happen to this pilot group right now is that Jerry's kids in St. George fire LeBarbeque for not coming to terms with his pilots...and the rest is to be continued.

 

[ArtVandalay]

ASA guys,

Don't take this crap from the company. 8 years without a contract? You must be the most patient group in aviation. It's time to take action. I would be pissed.

 

[ohplease!]

ohplease! you are such a Tool!! I have seen you in the crew room and know what you look like. I will be sure to point you out to the rest of the ASA pilots.

Strike Vote-YES

come over and introduce yourself then. I'll buy you a cup of coffee and we can actually talk.

 

[Stifler's Mom]

Drive Thru Window

come over and introduce yourself then. I'll buy you a cup of coffee and we can actually talk.

Talk about it? Talk about it? Geez, do what I did to the last guy that disagreed with me. Put his head through the wall by the coffee pot.

 

[PalmettoPilot]

The way I see it a good contract sucks (we shrink)...a bad contract sucks ( this place will suck more)...no contract we strike (ASA ends its existance)...for some reason everywhere I look right now I see nothing but suckiness...and bad management to go along with it....

I disagree with the good contract part of your statement. Management wants us to believe that if we negotiate and sign a FAIR contract that we won't get growth, DAL will take away flying etc etc. DAL doesn't care what we get paid. They care about the bottom line, how much does it cost to operate our planes. Yeah one affects the other but it isn't necessarily a DIRECT affect. It is possible to pay the employees fairly and reduce costs in other ways.

 

[shamrock]

Talk about it? Talk about it? Geez, do what I did to the last guy that disagreed with me. Put his head through the wall by the coffee pot.

So that's what happened!

I figured there was another Arnold/Hall debate in the crew lounge and Bob finally got tired of the double talk and took things into his own hands. You're intials wouldn't happen to be BA would they, Stifler?

 

[FDJ2]

we must have perfectly solid scope, merger and fragmentation language.

Just don't get any "predatory " scope that would prevent other pilots from bidding on the flying. Remember, it is part of the RJDC mantra that no pilot group "owns" any code flying. That is the exclusive property of management and you can not have scope that limits the outsourcing of an airlines code.

 

[puddlejumper101]

I disagree with the good contract part of your statement. Management wants us to believe that if we negotiate and sign a FAIR contract that we won't get growth, DAL will take away flying etc etc. DAL doesn't care what we get paid. They care about the bottom line, how much does it cost to operate our planes. Yeah one affects the other but it isn't necessarily a DIRECT affect. It is possible to pay the employees fairly and reduce costs in other ways.

you are right...i agree...its just hard to see a good side to any of this right now. the bottom line is I have never and will never trust this management.
This is the type of management that would pull the Mesa crap at a moments notice. I hope we sign a fair contract...in fact, I expect nothing less...but here is what I am getting at...if we sign a fair contract, don't be surprised if we become a Comair...this management is the type that would do that...until the top is completely changed...I don't trust them...never have never will...For that reason alone I hope we don't settle for crap. If we are going to get screwed in the end no matter what...then I hope we go down swinging.

 

[Halo_RJdriver]

Hoo Rah Asa

If ASA trys to devalue our skills and pay us nothing, how many of you are ready to just do something else?

I will not start over at the bottom of another airline and BL and ASA need to realize a lot of us won't do that. I think many of us will just leave and get another job with our college educations. Not flying an airplane is not the end of the world.

Give us a fair contract for our valuable skills or I am walking away doing something else.

How many of you feel the same way?

IF ASA walks away DAL will most likely LIquidate in my prospective. The question is how prepared DAL is to do without all those departures in ATL. It might take a month but without ATL clicking smooth it will be OVER>

 

[General Lee]

Yea, its not the end of the world. This job is really getting to the point where it is not worth it, especially if ASA experiences more stagnation. One can only go on trying to make a living on $30,000/yr for so long, and under such crappy work rules and labor/management unrest.

One thing I want to know, all these guys say it is so easy to get another job, but.....where? There arent really as many good paying jobs with good benefits there as you think. I know, Home Depot is what everyone says. But, are we all going to work there?

Anyway, I dont want to be part of the continued race to the bottom....

Hey.......where has the General been? Have my prayers been answered and his computer finally broke? One can dream.

Sorry to wreck your dream, but I am still here. I had a great New Years because I was on vacation in a very warm, tropical place. Good luck on your contract dispute.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Just don't get any "predatory " scope that would prevent other pilots from bidding on the flying. Remember, it is part of the RJDC mantra that no pilot group "owns" any code flying. That is the exclusive property of management and you can not have scope that limits the outsourcing of an airlines code.

OOOOOOOOOOH SNAP! I can't believe FINS actually said that. He just contradicted himself. The RJDC will expell him now.


Bye Bye--General Lee