alcohol incident effects

[rjl2001]

OK, thought maybe someone in here could shed some light on my question. Right now I am USCG enlisted with a year left of active duty. Have had plans of finishing my degree when I get out, and getting a comission into the USAF or USN via ROTC/OCS. Am thinking NFO in the USN/USMC in particular.

Last weekend I was arrested for 'drunk in public' after my neighbor called the police and they found me passed out on my doorstep as I did not have my keys and was locked out of my apartment. Yes I was drunk, and yes I was in public I suppose by all of 1 foot. My command slapped me with what the CG calls an 'alcohol incident' and now I am left wondering what adverse effects this could/may cause me in the future? Could this be a definite deal breaker when applying for that NFO slot, or an AF Air Battle Manager?

 

[SIG600]

Own up to it, and walk a straight line from here out. I don't think it'll be a deal breaker. Fitreps and CO's letters of recommendation are gonna say more about you than passing out on the lawn and getting stupid charge like that. Just own up to it and move on. Why NFO out of curiosity?

 

[Pistlpetet]

Pay to get yourself a good lawyer. Let the lawyer get the thing thrown out, by his secret handshakes, or arranging to have you make a contribution to local police fund. Innocent until proven guilty. If charges are dropped, your command "Should" retract their "Punishment". If it is thrown out, in essence you should never have been arrested. In america they can arrest you for anything, does not mean you are guilty. Like SIG said, own up to it, but fight like a MOFO to get it washed away. If you are an enlisted guy, it is not like they are going put that on your DD214 when you get out. If you get out, and apply to a officer program, telling them you got arrested for something so stupid (Like not everyone has been drunk in public before), and it was thrown out of court, it should not be a show stopper.

A friend of mine got a DUI as Senior CPT. Luckily in Louisianna you pay some cash, do some community service, and it is wiped away for first timers. He got no bad paperwork, got promoted to MAJ, and it was a non-event.

Only in America could they actually arrest somebody for such a stupid thing. Even more stupid, they have started to arrest drunk people in bars for DIP. Good luck, Don't get shafted by some obviously stupid arrest and law.

____________________________________________________________

SAN ANTONIO, Texas (Reuters) - Texas has begun sending undercover agents into bars to arrest drinkers for being drunk, a spokeswoman for the Texas Alcoholic Beverage Commission said on Wednesday.

The first sting operation was conducted recently in a Dallas suburb where agents infiltrated 36 bars and arrested 30 people for public intoxication, said the commission's Carolyn Beck.
Being in a bar does not exempt one from the state laws against public drunkenness, Beck said.
The goal, she said, was to detain drunks before they leave a bar and go do something dangerous like drive a car.

"We feel that the only way we're going to get at the drunk driving problem and the problem of people hurting each other while drunk is by crackdowns like this," she said.
"There are a lot of dangerous and stupid things people do when they're intoxicated, other than get behind the wheel of a car," Beck said. "People walk out into traffic and get run over, people jump off of balconies trying to reach a swimming pool and miss."
She said the sting operations would continue throughout the state.

 

[rjl2001]

OK guys, appreciate the feedback. Think I've decided I will talk to a lawyer and see if they can help. If I try to get it knocked out of court, I can't make things any worse by trying right? But it's reassuring to know that this should not hinder my chances of getting a comission.

As far as why NFO... I've given up hope that I'll wake up one day with better depth perception. Plus the more I've looked into the job, it actually seems like something I would enjoy doing. Ya, everyone wants to fly, but NFO looks just as challenging and most of their missions sound pretty interesting to me.

And I've read that before about charging people with being drunk in public while in a bar. Apparently in VA theres been a couple cities that actually had undercover police inside bars just waiting to arrest people for that. No matter if they are being loud or troublesome. Guess you just have to be that much more cautious about drinking. Coming from duty in Key West, half of Duval St. would be guilty of that charge on any given night lol.

 

[Mooseflyer]

Not really clear, but I assume you live off-base? If so, you'll go to civil court downtown for this and I wholeheartedly agree with the above posters that a lawyer should be able to get this thrown out (i.e. charges dropped). If you successfully get the charges dropped, then the incident should have no bearing whatsoever on your future in the military because, in essence, it never happened. The Area Defense Council (ADC) office on base (or a nearby base) should have a military lawyer who can recommend some options, a course of action, and a civillian attorney for your appearance in court. They (the ADC) deal with this type of thing on a frequent basis.

I do not agree with the above posters, however, when they say that you should own up to it with your chain of command (assuming a criminal charge from uncle sam). If the military is charging you with something, you will be read your rights - two of which are the right to remain silent and and the right to an attorney. Take them up on those rights - clam up and call the ADC.

 

[SIG600]

I do not agree with the above posters, however, when they say that you should own up to it with your chain of command (assuming a criminal charge from uncle sam). If the military is charging you with something, you will be read your rights - two of which are the right to remain silent and and the right to an attorney. Take them up on those rights - clam up and call the ADC.

So you're saying he SHOULDN'T tell/have told his chain of command?

 

[Mooseflyer]

So you're saying he SHOULDN'T tell/have told his chain of command?

He says he was "slapped with an alcohol incident" from somone in his chain of command. Not very descriptive - did he mean some sort of administrative reprimand or an actual UCMJ charge?
I'm saying if he has an actual UCMJ charge pending (had his rights read to him), then he should not say another word before seeking legal council.

 

[Purple Promisee]

Not legal advice, but a roadmap of things to consider:

A lawyer (one who knows civilian and military law) may be able to beat the civil charge, or - perhaps just as good - plead it down to something not alcohol related (public nuisance, etc.).

Your military situation depends on what type of proceeding has occured. At an Article 15 (the Navy calls it Captain's Mast, I believe the CG does too) then beating the civilian ticket won't equal beating the Article 15 b/c the burden/standard of proof is lower. I.e. the CO can impose disciplinary action on you even if there's not enough evidence to convict you in a criminal (Court Martial) proceeding. --It goes back to Mast being an instrument of leadership, not of justice ... one of those things that causes folks to say military justice is to justice what military music is to music.

If an individual has beaten a civilian rap and hasn't yet gone to an article 15 (but is being "sent" to one), the individual may consider "refusing the Article 15 in lieu of Court Martial" (something that's your right, unless you're underway at the time of the Art. 15, not the incident, this is important b/c a common commander's tactic is to wait until being underway to hold Art 15's for all the "bad actors" from the previous ashore period). This does not mean that they have to court martial the individual, just that it's their only punitive alternative.

The case gets turned over to the JAG corps and if they don't think they have the evidence to prove the case beyond a reasonable doubt (e.g. no underlying civil conviction, no eyewitnesses w/ expertise in intoxication (your d/h neighbor)) they drop it ... end of story*.

BUT: one should weigh heavily the consequences of refusing mast i/l/o court martial ... it's like saying the F word in front of mom. You're playing w/ the big boys now and if you lose i.e., they do decide to court martial you and you lose, that would be the worse possible outcome -- severe implications to military and civilian career potential; whereas an article 15 would probably limit your military option (officer accession program) but it's not a criminal conviction and nobody "out here" knows what it is

*unless of course the case has such political gravitas that the JAG's get strong armed into pushing a rope -- this happened in Tailhook -- lots of bad acts, no hard evidence of who dunnit, forced courts martial, no convictions.

AGAIN, not legal advice ... but I think you need some. get a lawyer who knows mil law as well as civilian crim law. The phone books are full of 'em, or email me offline, I can help you find one in your jurisdiction.

 

[SIG600]

He says he was "slapped with an alcohol incident" from somone in his chain of command. Not very descriptive - did he mean some sort of administrative reprimand or an actual UCMJ charge?
I'm saying if he has an actual UCMJ charge pending (had his rights read to him), then he should not say another word before seeking legal council.

Rog, personally I think a UCMJ charge is a little excessive for something that stupid. Maybe NJP, and a little "you're a retard, you know you screwed up" counceling... but past performance/behavior would probably dictate the path best taken more than anything.


On a side note... I'd like to thank the politicians in the great state of Texas for trying to save us, from ourselves. If I was a bar owner (or any place that sells alcohol) I'd be PISSED. I can see this happening in California, but Texas??? If any state was far from crazy I thought it was them. Getting piss drink on a night out with your friends is a god given right as an American!

 

[rhinodriver]

Heck, sounds like you would fit right in! Wish you were in my squadron. If this had happened to an Officer we would be joking about it for the rest of his time in the squadron. The only difference is you got caught. Maybe he'd even get a really cool callsign out of it. Something like "convict" or maybe "doormat". The only real killer now is the dreaded DUI...