AIR INC & Kit Darby, Disappointment

[ExecJetCA]

Was anyone else upset with the whole Dallas job fair, or was I the only one. I thought Fed Ex and UPS were there to take resumes, and interview. What a waste of money, what false hopes and advertising. The working poor get poorer and UAL wide body Captian Kit Darby gets richer. It is time that we start our own job fairs, or do something.

 

[TX_DFW]

I thought about going. From what ive heard im glad i didnt.

 

[TOGA]

Back in Sep of '99, I was "stupid enough to give him my money". After months of sending dozens of unanswered resumes, I went to the seminar in MSP. I was hired on the spot by one company and scheduled an interview with another. Within three days of getting home, three more companies had called to schedule interviews. I'm currently working for one of those three . . . ExpressJet. I know times have changed, and maybe that's the problem . . . but it worked for me. I suggest visiting aviationinterviews.com . . . if you'd like a fresh (and free) perspective on similar information.

 

[Relic01]

I was there and to each his own. I saw about 6 guys who were scheduled for interviews with both America West and Air Tran. I was there to get my first part 121 job and the info was excellent. It was an opportunity for the airlines to dispell all the rumors out there. Unfortunately, not enough people report about the positives as do about their own disappointments. In times like these you do not focus on one or two airlines, you market yourself to all and take what you get.

Many people where scheduled with both American Eagle and Pinnacle for future interviews. No where else would they have had this opportunity.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Who all was there this time?

 

[bobbysamd]

Kit strikes again

What a waste of money, what false hopes and advertising. The working poor get poorer and UAL wide body Captian Kit Darby gets richer. It is time that we start our own job fairs, or do something.

That something is to use your own wherewithal and resources and not fork them over to the Pied Piper of the Pilot Shortage.

It was about 1987 when Kit proclaimed that forty thousand pilots would be needed over the next ten years. It sounded plausible, but so do most sophistries. It made the news, with FAPA being the quoted source - undoubtedly after Kit mailed a flurry of news releases to the media. Kit brought professional aviation to the masses by advertising in mainstream pilot mags, stating that FAPA was your superhighway to the majors! Kit made it sound easy in his Career Pilot articles and with his hiring manuals and interview gauge. We found out soon enough there was no pilot shortage after our phones did not ring after sending tons of resumes. Some of us found out the hard way that his gauge was, at best, unreliable.

I attended a Kit job fair in LAX nearly eleven years ago. It was a waste of time, except that I met Irv Jasinski. I had used Irv to prep for an interview several months before.

You don't need Kit. With the advent of the internet, airline contact information is just a mouseclick away. Do your own research. This message board provides more real-time, and probably more authentic, hiring and interview information, and far better advice, than Kit ever did.

Save your money by not flipping it to Kit. Best of luck with your job search.

 

[pilotyip]

I was there

I was there recruiting for my airline, there were about 600 pilots there, I would say 1/3 of the pilots I saw were laid off major pilots. The ATA line was the longest, Fedex said they have about 70 in their pool. Airtran had a long line, AWA had a long line, Commuair was hiring, American Eagle was hiring, Air Net was hiring. This is an old theme the pro and con of Kit, I think it is good deal, and wish these would have been around back in the 70's when I left the Navy. Kit provides a service, it is up to the individual to elect to attend or not attend, the choice is theirs alone and it is not up to anyone to judge anyone's choice.

 

[dlredline]

I went to the DFW job fair last year fresh on furlough. I noticed during the "pilot-shortage" power point presentation that Kit Darby and AirInc. never site a single source of the information they base their industry analysis on, so the nice pie charts and graphs are suspect at best (for those in attendance, check out the "Career Pilot Guide" they handed out, and I challenge you to find a source for any chart or graph they show). And most of the presentation denigrated into a sales pitch for some book or pamplet or "counseling service" for sale outside in the hall.

But the coup de grace was half way through the airline presentations in the auditorium, when Lonnie Robinson (an old friend of Kit Darby's) from USAirways walks up to the microphone and speaks for 20 minutes of the virtues of flying for his airline. This with over 1500 U pilots on furlough at the time and literally hundreds of stunned furloughed U pilots in the audience. An hour later, he's stroking his ego outside the hall actually accepting resumes from several clueless though well intentioned wannabees. I knew at that point I'd be taken for a $150 ride, chalked it up as a "live and learn" experience, and walked out to catch a flight home.

I learned absolutely nothing there that I couldn't have gotten from just a little reserach myself. Some may need a seminar like this as a "crutch" to help them in their job search, but I think you sell yourself short. Kit Darby doesn't provide anything you can't get (or do) on your own. I would never do it again.

Red

 

[nat]

FWIW, the guy who started aviationinterviews.com has had a job fair of his own last fall. I know him personally and know that he is trying to get back to just helping people and not taking all of their money. I know it did cost something, but he shoots you straight and wants to give Kit Darby some competition. He hopes to have one in the spring sometime and I know that his intentions are sincere. He has a job that is totally unrelated to aviation, but works as a pilot as well. Visit his website and I am sure you will hear more information.

 

[reepicheep]

Most seasoned pilots will tell you 90% of the weekend is superfluous. It's the couple minutes of face time you can get with people from jetBlue, America West, ATA, etc..., that could put you over-the-top for an interview, that makes it worth it. You're in the same stack with 5,000 other airline pilots and this might be the only way to stand out.

 

[pilotyip]

exactly

Exactly recipcheep! and that is the reason to go. That is what the recruiter (Cheif Pilot) for ATA said, "A face to face with me is almost the same as an internal recommendation. It will separate you from the crowd and get you an application you might not otherwise be able to get". To attend the conference can do you no harm, it may give you a leg up. It is not up to Kit's detractors to make up your mind for you. As far as other recruiting shows go, I used to attend the UPAS/AEPS recruiting shows, the pilot population attending was so low you only saw a few candidates. Kit has the volumn.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Lonnie

I can't believe that Lonnie Robinson is still doing that.

I KNOW he is not there as an official representative of US Airways.

Perhaps a letter to Dave Siegel addressing the completely lack of sensitivity of the corporation sending a representative to a pilot job-fair with over 1800 pilots on furlough might be an appropriate way to entice him to stay at home next time.

That airline never ceases to amaze me. Nearly two years since my furlough and they're still finding ways to bone people.

 

[satpak77]

Lonnie part 2

Its all about me

anything to help "me" out

 

[dlredline]

Re: Lonnie

I can't believe that Lonnie Robinson is still doing that.

I KNOW he is not there as an official representative of US Airways.

Perhaps a letter to Dave Siegel addressing the completely lack of sensitivity of the corporation sending a representative to a pilot job-fair with over 1800 pilots on furlough might be an appropriate way to entice him to stay at home next time.

That airline never ceases to amaze me. Nearly two years since my furlough and they're still finding ways to bone people.

FA,

I sent an email to JCM Dave, and his short reply was the Lonnie didn't "officially" represent U at this job fair. I exchanged several "spirited" emails with Kit as well. The point he tried to make was that Lonnie came to give "perpective" to the job search ("you can't be serious, Kit!"). He declined to comment on Lonnie accepting resumes. We agreed to disagree.

I considered Lonnie's presence at a job fair (he wore both an ALPA pin and a USAirways button) a slap in the face of all the professionals in attendance who were summarily dismissed by both their union and airline. The fact that Kit Darby would even allow this moron podium time at a job fair speaks volumes at the lack of compassion by AirInc and desire to stroke the ego of one of Kit's "buddies". It's all about making a buck.

I agree with the several posts that the opportunity to meet and "press flesh" with recruiters is valuable to some, but there's got to be a better way than the 3 hour AirInc sales pitch we had to sit through before meeting recruiters. Airlines like Airtran who tell the masses you can get an interview on the spot at AirInc conferences only perpetuate the problem. A professional pilot should not have to subsidize Kit Darby to further his/her career. And I know JetBlue attends these conferences, too. At least Dean and company do not schedule interviews from there, and use the time to provide information to those who ask. Information, by the way, that is readily available through other sources.

Yep, there's got to be a better way.

Red

 

[dlredline]

More disinformation . . .

And this from the recent AirInc "Careers" magazine:


Kit Darby: ". . . early and mandatory age-60 retirements will create the need for 300-500 each year at each airline. So, even without growth, in three to five years new pilots will be needed just to maintain these airlines at the sizes they are now. And with any growth at all, the need for new pilots will come even sooner."

What Kit fails to mention is that many of the carriers he included in this statement are currently "restructuring" their pilot agreements for productivity improvements to compete with profitable LCC's. These productivity improvements will negate any attrition benefits seen from retirements, and could perhaps, in the example of USAirways, result in additional furloughs.

Kit Darby: "For those fixated on the large number of furloughed pilots - nearly 10,000 at the end of 2003 - I remind you that the number of pilots who found new jobs over the past two years is over 11,000."

Possibly (Airinc's numbers, mind you), but what Kit doesn't tell you is that a greater percentage of these pilots were furloughed major airline pilots who "had" to accept positions at smaller carriers at a substantial reduction of pay and benefits just to remain flying and "competitive" in this environment. These weren't close to being "new" pilots entering the marketplace with "new" jobs. It's been said that the "pilot shortage" myth perpetuated by Kit Darby and AirInc is in fact just that, a myth, as the industry more accurately "recycles" pilots within the industry.

Now, I tend to also have a "glass half full" approach to life, just like Kit apparently has. The difference is that when Kit publishes his in a career magazine, his attempt is to promote and maintain a dues paying client base by perpetuating a myth of an impending shortage with statements not supported by reality.

I wish the best for everyone, and hope all find the opportunities they desire. There are many, MANY resources out there available to you in your job search. If you find AirInc's services benefitial, by all means use them. Just don't believe the rhetoric coming from their leadership, their motives are more financial than altruistic.

Best of luck to all!

Red

 

[maineiac]

Never used Kit and never will. Went to college learned how to write a resume and cover letter. Flew as a CFI, Charter Pilot to get experiance. Was dependable at all my jobs. Studied and told the truth on interviews (What would your current employer say if we called him right now and told him you were here? He would ask how am I doing). And have never had aproblem getting an interview or a job. Even after getting furloughed. I guess I am old school.

 

[bobbysamd]

Disinformation

Kit Darby: ". . . early and mandatory age-60 retirements will create the need for 300-500 each year at each airline. So, even without growth, in three to five years new pilots will be needed just to maintain these airlines at the sizes they are now. And with any growth at all, the need for new pilots will come even sooner."

* * * *

Kit Darby: "For those fixated on the large number of furloughed pilots - nearly 10,000 at the end of 2003 - I remind you that the number of pilots who found new jobs over the past two years is over 11,000."

This last comment is particularly rich - something that furloughees were just waiting to hear.

It's the same load of crap that Kit has been disseminating since 1987. Once more, "forty-thousand pilots will be needed during the next ten years."

Kit's not the only one who is peddling the pilot shortage. Even academia is peddling it, to-wit, this letter by Dr. Harvey Birdseye of the aviation department at Lane Community College in Oregon.

I second Maineiac's comments. Learn to write a good cover letter and resume, and trust your abilities. Don't trust Kit and his lackeys to help you get the job you want.

 

[eaglefly]

Kit Darby's business is designed for one thing.

To make Kit Darby money.

Why does this surprise anyone.

He is in the "sales" business.

Everybody and anybody in that line of work has the same objective.

The advantage he has is the plentiful supply of hungry suckers that exist in greater numbers in a sluggish economy than in a healthy one.

In any case it will never change and he'll continue to do just fine.

His next "seminar" will be packed with saps holding checks.

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

resurrecting the dead horse...

All the bs and whining about false hopes, etc. If you are foolish enough to believe the snake-oil side to kit's product, then you will no doubt fail in more endeavors than just a career as an airline pilot.

If you are foolish enough to ignore all of the success stories people have related regarding attending such job fairs, then you will certainly not gain any sort of edge in the hiring competition and are also likely to fail in your job-hunting endeavor.

If you regularly heed the advice of those who have failed before you, you will likely also fail.

Read again whay PilotYIP writes. He's a recruiter for his company who attends these fairs and has said he has hired right from the fairs!!!

How any rational-thinking person could not see there is an opportunity to advance your hiring potential for the price of a good asian massage is madness to me.

 

[dlredline]

Re: resurrecting the dead horse...

. . . Read again whay PilotYIP writes. He's a recruiter for his company who attends these fairs and has said he has hired right from the fairs!!!

I guess this is what bothers me the most. Someone with a schedule conflict (family matters, job, etc.) and can't attend an AirInc conference is at an automatic disadvantage to someone who shells out $$ to Kit Darby. These employers who actively "hire" pilots at a job fair full of financial motive to it's organizer are perpetuating the problem of Kit's get-rich scheme at the expense of desperate pilots.

And I've yet to hear an explanation (not that I expect to) why in the world they would allow someone like Lonnie Robinson of USAirways (invited by Kit Darby himself) to walk the halls accepting resumes, dodging the hundreds of furloughees from the very airline he holds himself out to "represent". Many were insulted by his actions at a JOB fair.

I commend PilotYIP's effort to employ many of our own, though I respectfully disagree with his approach. And do I consider this "beating a dead horse"? Absolutely not! Not as long as Kit Darby continues to propagate misleading information to his clients who pay hundreds of $$ a year erroneously subsidizing the "pilot shortage" myth.

Red