Advice needed

[braidkid]

Hello,
I am currently a flight instructor with 1250 TT and only 55 MT. Recently I've been debating whether to try to get on with a regional or go the freight route. My thinking is if I get on with a freight company such as Flight Express or Ram Air, I will have a lot more options and it will benifit me in the long run to do freight before regionals, etc...

Would you guys agree that doing freight for a while is benificial to one's career as an aspiring professional pilot? Is freight a waste of time? I'm not sure at this point whether I want to go to the airlines or corporate but I figure doing freight will provide a better chance at both opportunities.

Any thoughts?

 

[SMOE]

If your young, go freight. The airlines can wait. It will make you a better Captain down the road no matter what your flying.

 

[vclean]

Seniority.

 

[328dude]

Be a Freight Dog!.

You'll gain invaluable experience, log plenty of time and get the PIC time quicker.

If you really want to log some time quick, fly for a an outfit that still has an FRB contract (Federal Reserve Bank) or the US Mail.

Also, Turbine freight machines would be a plus.

 

[pppilot]

If airline flying is your career goal, then I would get your foot in the door now if you are able. Network to get to know people inside the regionals that can help you out (i.e. walk your stuff in). There are several regionals that are calling for interviews, your multi time might be a hardship you will have when looking towards some companies. So get more multi, this is where freight can benefit, but you can get it other ways.

Be patient, be persistent and you will get the call, heck I am getting calls now and I have been knocking on doors for awhile now, literally knocking on doors!

Now if you want corporate in the future, network even more. I assume that flying for a good corporate company is fairly difficult to get on with, have not tried myself so I cannot take a hard stance on it.
With majors leaving some markets, regionals are jumping all over the routes and growing. So it is a good time to try and get on with a regional, just make sure to research so you pick the regionals you want to fly for and not one that will make you despise this industry.


Anyway this is coming from someone who is still a flight instructor looking in from the outside, so take it with a grain of salt, my 2 cents, it's hot in these rhino's, whatever.



pp

 

[Resume Writer]

Braid,

It depends upon your ultimate goal. I do not think flying freight will hurt you at all and it will give you the chance to get more ME time. I am not certain there are too many regionals that will look at you right now without at least 100 ME. If you were to go fly freight for a year, you can build ME and PIC time (depending on the outfit) and then be more competitive. Freight time will not hurt you in corporate or airline companies.

I agree that seniority is everything in this business. However, with your lack of ME time, I do not think too many of the regionals will even look at you at this point. Some will, however, where do you want to build your seniority? I would want to build it at a stable company that treats their employees like they are a valued part of the team.

Just my two cents!

Kathy

 

[braidkid]

Thank you everyone for your input. I'm not sure what my ultimate career goals are but I just want to be the best pilot I can be. I figure being a freight dog is more valuable experience than sitting SIC somewhere on a jungle jet. I think the airlines would be sort of an "early retirement."

 

[WhiteCloud]

I figure being a freight dog is more valuable experience than sitting SIC somewhere on a jungle jet.

Don't fool yourself on this one. ME jet time (SIC or PIC) will get you further down the road than Seneca time at Ram Air. If you really feel the need you can fly for a piston 135 operator on your days off. Those part time jobs are easy to get once you're flying for an airline. Not so easy if you're working as a CFI. Good luck.

 

[xrated]

Don't fool yourself on this one. ME jet time (SIC or PIC) will get you further down the road than Seneca time at Ram Air. If you really feel the need you can fly for a piston 135 operator on your days off. .

Did this guy just say get a part time job on your days off while working at a commuter? I'm guessing his pot smoking is clouding his judgement. First off, you don't get time off when you are a junior guy at a regional. Ya, you get to go home from time to time, but it will be spent doing laundry, mowing the lawn, etc etc, no way in hell do you have time for another part time flying gig.

Every pilot will have an opinion on this one, but in the end, you're going to have to make as educated a decision as you can and roll the dice. You can make connections and network at any aviation job you get. Luck of the draw could ultimately be the your lucky break......or it can break you.

 

[wheelsup]

Hello,
I am currently a flight instructor with 1250 TT and only 55 MT. Recently I've been debating whether to try to get on with a regional or go the freight route. My thinking is if I get on with a freight company such as Flight Express or Ram Air, I will have a lot more options and it will benifit me in the long run to do freight before regionals, etc...

I can't talk from experience but I can say what I decided because I was pretty much in your shoes.

In the middle of last month, I had about 920 hours TT and 82 multi. I was about 18 hours short to start interviewing and meeting mins for the bottom feeders. Well, my school lost both twins in a hurricane and even though they stated they were top priority I just didn't believe them.

My school also had GREAT connections with Airnet, i.e. you get the mins and they call up there and you go for an interview.

If i got the 1200 TT to go to Airnet, then I'd have to wait another year before I could leave and go to a regional (training commitment). My former MEI went to Airnet and he can't wait to get out...and that's after he talked so great about it before leaving. So my mind was made up...no freight!

I'm a firm believer in not having to pay for training, etc. etc., and I carried my multi time over to this. I know there are a TON of people who did buy twin time and are now at airlines, however I just wasn't in the financial position nor did I want to spend more money on this career...and I'm only 23!

So what did I do? I signed a 12 month contract with a school that flies bonanza's and barons exclusively so in 12 months time I'll be floating around 2000 TT and 300 or so multi. This all while making about $24,000-$30,000 over the next year - not a bad gig for a CFI! This way I can save a bunch of $$, and in 12 months (well now 11) go to the regional of my choice if they're still hiring (Air Wisonsin is my goal - I love the BAE 146).

Good luck
~wheelsup

 

[I.P. Freley]

Did this guy just say get a part time job on your days off while working at a commuter? I'm guessing his pot smoking is clouding his judgement.

Not to mention that depending upon the commuter, you won't be allowed to do any outside flying (for pay) without getting specific permission from your CP, which may or may not be forthcoming.

 

[I.P. Freley]

I figure being a freight dog is more valuable experience than sitting SIC somewhere on a jungle jet.

How, exactly, do you figure THAT? It doesn't sound like you want an airline job, anyway, it being "early retirement" and all.

In the middle of last month, I had about 920 hours TT and 82 multi. I was about 18 hours short to start interviewing and meeting mins for the bottom feeders.

Is ExpressJet a "bottom feeder", then?

 

[milehigh6080]

Is ExpressJet a "bottom feeder", then?

Minimums are 600/100- that sounds pretty much like the bottom to me

 

[braidkid]

How, exactly, do you figure THAT? It doesn't sound like you want an airline job, anyway, it being "early retirement" and all.

What I meant by that was flying single pilot IFR is more demanding than two pilot IFR. Perhaps I'm wrong??? I would definately be interested in the airlines but I would also like to do corporate as well.

The way I see it is this....I have 55MT which is worthless. I could go buy 150 multi hours and hope to get on with some regional.....OR....I could go fly freight for a couple years, have around 1000MT and pretty much have my choice of regional to go to and perhaps some other options as well.

Would you buy the 150 hours of multi hoping for a regional job or would you go out there and earn it flying freight?

 

[T-Gates]

What I meant by that was flying single pilot IFR is more demanding than two pilot IFR. Perhaps I'm wrong??? I would definately be interested in the airlines but I would also like to do corporate as well.

The way I see it is this....I have 55MT which is worthless. I could go buy 150 multi hours and hope to get on with some regional.....OR....I could go fly freight for a couple years, have around 1000MT and pretty much have my choice of regional to go to and perhaps some other options as well.

Would you buy the 150 hours of multi hoping for a regional job or would you go out there and earn it flying freight?

Single pilot IFR and Two Pilot IFR can be equally demanding.... Because usually in a two crewed airplane your moving faster, and you have more stuff to do. While in a Baron, you have your hands tied trying to get just your stuff set up, when you are PNF on a larger jet/turboprop, you will find yourself tending to your stuff, plus helping the PF get his side of the cockpit ready. Throw an FMS in there and you will find yourself with a workload similar to if not greater than a single pilot situation.

The fact is you don't have enough ME time to get a job anywhere but a freight company.... You can either go into debt and buy some ME time, or go get a job flying freight in a twin for Ram, Package Express, AirNet, etc, and get paid to get that same Multi-PIC, while also getting your IFR skills to the sharpest they've been.

Take that time flying freight to decide what you want to do with your career, then once you hit the minimums, start applying. You'll find that if hiring stays in the boom it's in right now, you shouldn't have a problem making the jump from single pilot freight to a regional. Many of your peers have made that same jump...... But also NETWORK! Thats the key to everything in this industry.

 

[wheelsup]

Is ExpressJet a "bottom feeder", then?

If upgrade time there was quicker, it would be WELL worth it to go there. If I had my choice, I'd go someplace that paid well, or to an airline that upgrades come quick (I think Mesa is around 6 months for Dash 8 and 2 years for CRJ, that's worth it IMHO). Pinnacle is running 1.5 years or so for upgrade, told to me by a new FO there. When my time comes, we'll see what I end up doing.

Not to mention that COEX guys are talking strike, and pay rates remain unrealistically low for their operation, again IMHO!

~wheelsup

 

[I.P. Freley]

Pinnacle is running 1.5 years or so for upgrade, told to me by a new FO there. When my time comes, we'll see what I end up doing.

I don't work there, mind you, but I think you'd better do a search around the Pinnacle threads and see what a new-hire at PCL is REALLY looking at for upgrade, and I assure you from what I've heard it's going to be far, far more than 18mos (if you got on there at "the right time, that may be accurate, but not NOW).

 

[I.P. Freley]

Would you buy the 150 hours of multi hoping for a regional job or would you go out there and earn it flying freight?

I'd get it flying freight before I'd buy it, but that's not the point I'm making. It sounds like you look at the airlines as the "junior league" or something, and I think you have the wrong attitude about the work 121 pilots do. If your attitude is that you'll be more competitive at a major or a regional with freight time as opposed to 121 time (even "right seat in a jungle jet), I think you're dead wrong.

If you're looking at freight as a way to get the multi time, by all means do it. And you don't need to do it for "a couple of years", either... If you want to get on with almost any regional that's hiring, you'll only need a couple of months. If you STAY at that freight outfit for a couple of years to get the 1000ME, then you'll be more competitive at a corporate outfit.

I guess it just depends upon what route you REALLY want to travel in this great industry... If it's airlines, get on at a 121 carrier ASAP. Obviously you need more time to get that job, and freight is but one way to do it (have you considered getting your MEI?)

 

[I.P. Freley]

Minimums are 600/100- that sounds pretty much like the bottom to me

I guess we have a basic disagreement on what a "bottom feeder" is, then.

 

[WhiteCloud]

Did this guy just say get a part time job on your days off while working at a commuter? I'm guessing his pot smoking is clouding his judgement. First off, you don't get time off when you are a junior guy at a regional.

Working part time as a CFI is a little more common part time pilot job but, yes, if you know the right people you can fly charters or 135 on days off. When I was doing it the CP just said don't miss any trips here. Later on he did some moonlighting with us too. CP's need some extra cash too and they all aren't "company" people.