50 nm from shore

[Secret Squirrel]

Do controllers know if a flight is authorized for flight over water beyond 50 nm (121)? We were being vectored around some weather which was forcing us further and further from shore. It is hard with my equipment to know exactly 50 nm from shore. Is there a controller policy on this?

 

[Oakum_Boy]

Interesting question. I've had some direct-to clearances which always seem to stay within the boundary but some have been pretty close.

 

[Choppy]

They usually know the routes that you are on comply with 50 or not. If you start vectoring away from the airway then i think you are on your own. That has been my experience.

 

[sardaddy]

Stupid question but I am not a commecial carrier and I don't remember reading anything in the FARs and my FAR/AIM is not really handy. But what is the concern for being 50 miles off shore? I routinely fly 50 miles off shore or more and return in a helicopter. But being that I am in a military aircraft the rules are different. Like I said, I have never heard of any 50 mile requirement. What rule does that refer to?

 

[FreightGod]

Overwater equipped or not.

Proper life rafts if memory serves right.

 

[ex208driver]

The rule is defintely on the emb145. We cannot go more than 50 miles offshore because we do not carry life rafts onboard the aircraft. Some airplanes have a 162 mile ring, but have to have special authorization. I believe ASA has this restriction so they can go to mexico from atlanta on the crj. I dont think the controllers have anyway of knowing this, but the crews do or should. We at expressjet have charts for this restriction in our jepps. We run into it going from EWR to Halifax and St Johns. Also to the caribbean from the different bases. And to parts of mexico and florida from IAH. These charts have the 50 mile ring from any land mass noted on it along with indentifying waypoints out there.

 

[sardaddy]

Well, I guess I knew the answer then. I knew the 50 nm rule for a life raft but since the original post asked "Do controllers know if a flight is authorized for flight over water beyond 50 nm (121)?" I assumed there must be some more ominous reason such as some vague ADIZ rule or something. They wouldn't know if you had a liferaft onboard or not unless you told them.

Whether you told them officially or not if you had a life raft on board would depend on what type of flight plan you filed. An ICAO flt plan would have that info but an FAA flt plan wouldn't.

 

[jetracer5]

If your driving around some weather you can break the 50nm rule.

 

[WTF]

Zip It

Stupid question but I am not a commecial carrier and I don't remember reading anything in the FARs and my FAR/AIM is not really handy. But what is the concern for being 50 miles off shore? I routinely fly 50 miles off shore or more and return in a helicopter. But being that I am in a military aircraft the rules are different. Like I said, I have never heard of any 50 mile requirement. What rule does that refer to?

Key reason to why you should keep your mouth shut. "I am not a commercial carrier and I don't remember reading anything in the FAR's". You don't know the rule, it doesn't pertain to you, you don't even have to follow the rule......BYE BYE.

 

[WTF]

The Rule

As far as the rule. You should file on your flight plan if you are equipped or not. It is required if you are international, and recommended domestic. Do it and you will not have to question the controllers intentions, don't you play the I wonder game with the shoreline.

 

[sardaddy]

WTF bite me. I didn't know the rule the poster was posting about so I asked a question.

So what is it like living where you are only allowed to know things that pertain directly to your job? It must be pretty boring where you are.

 

[CRJDispatchKid]

If your driving around some weather you can break the 50nm rule.

Any idea where I can reference this?

Thanks!

 

[jetracer5]

If your driving around some weather you can break the 50nm rule.

Any idea where I can reference this?

Thanks!

Well the ASA flight operations manual in reference to overwater operations says:

"the crews may not deviate outside the limits described except to the extent necessary to maintain the safe operation of the flight(e.g. thunderstorms)"

I'm not sure if this is a Far or anything, I just think its our company policy. But its just common sense! If your flying along and you are approaching a T-storm what are you to do. "lets go though it so we don't fly more then 50 miles from shore????" What do you think is more hazardous, penetrating a cell or flying more then 50nm from the shoreline!

 

[jetracer5]

Well, I guess I knew the answer then. I knew the 50 nm rule for a life raft but since the original post asked "Do controllers know if a flight is authorized for flight over water beyond 50 nm (121)?" I assumed there must be some more ominous reason such as some vague ADIZ rule or something. They wouldn't know if you had a liferaft onboard or not unless you told them.

Whether you told them officially or not if you had a life raft on board would depend on what type of flight plan you filed. An ICAO flt plan would have that info but an FAA flt plan wouldn't.

When our 700's are dispached over water up to 162nm they will have a OW1 before the filed flight plan on the dispach release letting the crews and I believe ATC know they are being dispached for extended over water operations