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Did SWA sign the agreement [law] ??

Well, SWA signed the agreement. Congress then codified it into law, where it was signed by the President.

Why do agreements/laws that involve SWA need to be in pencil?

Not sure what you're getting at.

Re: ridership and low fares... I'm not sure we need more people flying. At this point there is no reason to continue legacy airline decline in favor of growing SWA or other LCCs.

Don't know that your opinion on not needing "more people flying" is one shared by your Union. More people flying means more pilots employed. That's pretty much true in any airline market.

Besides, you misunderstood what I said; this didn't result in "legacy airline decline in favor of growing SWA." As often happens, the increased competition resulted in growth in ridership at both airports. That means growth at both airports' applicable airlines, both American at DFW, and SWA at Love, despite their stated "fears" for DFW's continued viability. This was actually predicted by every study undertaken by neutral parties, including the one commissioned by AA and the DFW airport authority, much to their own embarrassment.

Pitting one airport against another in hopes it creates a reason, is a SWA trick that needs to end.

Allowing competition is a "trick that needs to end"? Really?

Bubba
 
What "I'm getting at" is how many times has the WA, or any other thing like it, been changed to suit SWA?? (DFW should have never even been built and we'd have been spared the WA) And now SWA is unhappy (again) with what they just signed?? Sounds like it...

Who cares what ALPA thinks. A job created to fly the jobless around is all deregulation has amounted to. The cross section of humanity participating in air travel these days is a sad one. We spread more hate, disease and enable the participants of lowly or futile acts than empower any amount of anything positive. This huge system of mega airports and foolishly low airline tickets probably should have been preceded by some consideration of what passengers intentions, or their necessity might have been.
 
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What "I'm getting at" is how many times has the WA, or any other thing like it, been changed to suit SWA?? (DFW should have never even been built and we'd have been spared the WA) And now SWA is unhappy (again) with what they just signed?? Sounds like it...

Settle down, Flopgut, before you blow a gasket or something.

I get your "pencil" remark now, and the answer to "how many times" has some law been changed to "suit SWA," is one: the WA itself. You remember, the anti-competitive law that was forced on us over our objections by another airline's political stooge. The one that was created solely to change existing law specifically to hobble SWA and prevent competition, after we had prevailed in every court in the land, Texas and federal, that the other parties had dragged us to. So yeah, after nearly 30 years of being yoked by it, we lobbied to change the anti-Southwest law.

And so then all the parties then actually negotiated, and agreed to the compromise in 2008 that became the law that essentially got rid of the WA, with newer and narrower limitations. So I doubt you'll see SWA trying to change that law, since they actually agreed to these terms for a change, rather than them being forced on us.

It was me specifically, not my airline, who suggested to Andy that he have his airline lobby to change the law. And not to suit Southwest, but rather to help the other, hypothetical airlines that he claimed he was trying to "enable."

Who cares what ALPA thinks. A job created to fly the jobless around is all deregulation has amounted to. The cross section of humanity participating in air travel these days is a sad one. We spread more hate, disease and enable the participants of lowly or futile acts than empower any amount of anything positive. This huge system of mega airports and foolishly low airline tickets probably should have been preceded by some consideration of what passengers intentions, or their necessity might have been.

Well said, Comrade Flop. The government should decide everything for the "cross section of humanity" that inhabits the US. They should decide who has reason enough to travel, and then pick who actually gets to do it, along with how much they should pay. Some people just don't have a good enough reason to fly--they just think they do. Idiots.

And you're right; they certainly should never have built another, bigger airport in the Dallas area, despite the Texas population nearly tripling from 9.6 million in 1960 to 27.5 million in 2015. With the government only allowing the party faithful to travel, Love Field would surely be sufficient.

Thank God we have Flopgut (and the government) around to tell us, and give us, what we really need.

Bubba
 
You're welcome Bubba. I'm here for you anytime. Keep staring out L1 at these new places you're flying and your worldview will surely evolve.
 
Well said, Comrade Flop. The government should decide everything for the "cross section of humanity" that inhabits the US. They should decide who has reason enough to travel, and then pick who actually gets to do it, along with how much they should pay. Some people just don't have a good enough reason to fly--they just think they do. Idiots.

And you're right; they certainly should never have built another, bigger airport in the Dallas area, despite the Texas population nearly tripling from 9.6 million in 1960 to 27.5 million in 2015. With the government only allowing the party faithful to travel, Love Field would surely be sufficient.

Thank God we have Flopgut (and the government) around to tell us, and give us, what we really need.

Bubba

Bubba wins, Game, Set and Match. :D:D:D:beer:

Floppy loses . . . Summer School. :erm::erm::erm::mad::mad:

You're welcome Bubba. I'm here for you anytime. Keep staring out L1 at these new places you're flying and your worldview will surely evolve.

Like Argentina, Cuba, and North Korea?

:laugh:
 
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A job created to fly the jobless around is all deregulation has amounted to. The cross section of humanity participating in air travel these days is a sad one. We spread more hate, disease and enable the participants of lowly or futile acts than empower any amount of anything positive.
It's time to hang it up Sir. You are clearly defeated and miserable. Life is too short spend it doing something for which you harbor such contempt.
 
It's just election season Howard. Not to go political...

*Google "southwest airlines bernie sanders" that'll make you a proud spirit warrior

And I know how much you love links:

http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-po...y-triumphed-over-evidence-us-airline-industry

Enjoy! Now, find two or three sentences in there you can quote back to me, out of context of course (and please don't spare the red font!), and we'll meet back here in a couple days.
 
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It's just election season Howard. Not to go political...

*Google "southwest airlines bernie sanders" that'll make you a proud spirit warrior

And I know how much you love links:

http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-po...y-triumphed-over-evidence-us-airline-industry

Enjoy! Now, find two or three sentences in there you can quote back to me, out of context of course (and please don't spare the red font!), and we'll meet back here in a couple days.
You can wax nostalgic for the good old days before deregulation but those days are long gone and never coming back! The days of no competition and guaranteed profits are a remnant of the past. An airline actually has to compete now and I realize that frightens the hell out of you. Don't worry, airlines can still request restraining orders and drag new entrants to the market through years of bogus legal proceedings in order to avoid competition.
 
Hmmmm

The first transgression on pure competition (post deregulation) was American and Braniff not being allowed to go back into Love when SWA stayed. It's well documented and indesputable, SWA would have been put out of business if true competition had been allowed. You are what you detest.
 
Hmmmm

The first transgression on pure competition (post deregulation) was American and Braniff not being allowed to go back into Love when SWA stayed. It's well documented and indesputable, SWA would have been put out of business if true competition had been allowed. You are what you detest.

"Well documented and indesputable"? How about actually documenting a single case of what you claim, Flop? Oh, that's right--you can't. Repeating a disproven lie over and over is never going to make it true.

The fact is, that both Braniff and American (not to mention Texas International and your beloved Continental) preferred endless and meritless litigation--not to mention collusion and other dirty tricks, including illegal ones--to avoid actually having to compete with Southwest. Face it Flop--your airline is the one with the criminal record, not mine.

Bubba
 
https://tshaonline.org/handbook/online/articles/eps01

It was many things, but certainly not "meritless". Read the sequence of events, things could have easily gone the other way*

Take the media slant out of like the above and compare to what's happening today [thread topic]. I'd say SWA isn't too differently behaved now than those it fought 40 years ago. Who's frivolously suing who now Bubba? Which airline is trying to tell others what airport to fly from? *and they might sooner than later;)
 
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If an individual could buy a 737, fly it between 3 cities in TX, with almost no regulation or oversight, would airlines fight it? Something like an Uber sort of thing. I would hope it would be fought, because its not a level playing field. That's what SWA was in the early days when it had a TX only operating certificate.
 
Hmmmm

The first transgression on pure competition (post deregulation) was American and Braniff not being allowed to go back into Love when SWA stayed. It's well documented and indesputable, SWA would have been put out of business if true competition had been allowed. You are what you detest.
Well, considering the fact that the original Branniff ceased operation 3 years and change after deregulation went into effect I can't consider that airline a juggernaut that couldn't be competed with. Couple that with the fact that American did in fact return to serve Love Field, along with Continental, your premise is fatally flawed.

The only thing that prevented American and Braniff unfettered access to Love Field was American and Braniff. As early as 1940, American and Braniff negotiated a deal to build an airport between Dallas and Ft. Worth. As you well know, in 1968 all the airlines operating at Love Field signed an agreement to move their operations to DFW when it opened. They weren't coerced into signing that document, they did it freely without reservation. It was clearly evident that the business model envisioned by both airlines deemed Love unsuitable for their proposed expansion.
 

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