Climbing above RVSM airspace

[swamprat]

All,
Forgive my ignorance. My first time taking delivery of a new aircraft and awaiting approval of our RVSM LOA. Does anyone have any experience with getting clearance from ATC to climb through RVSM to take advantage of altitudes above 410? If so are than any particular ways to request this on the flight plan? Taking delivery next week and really don't want to be stuck low for up to 60 days. Local FSDO is already expecting us and the HMU flight is being accomplished on delivery day.

Thanks for your input!

 

[LJ45]

neg RVSM on flight plan remarks helps along with the appropriate flight plan code. We went to FL430 and FL450 many times in a new Lear. You might get a delayed climb and early descent. Also, a real early descent in the NE

 

[gern_blanston]

Pack a little extra fuel in case you're held down on departure and started down early on arrival, but we had no problems on cross-country flights after delivery for a few weeks until we got our LOAs.

 

[guido411]

Plan to stay low and burn the extra gas. ATC is not required to let you climb even if they have no conflicts. The plus side is your TAS should be awesome at FL280.

 

[bizjet800]

Does anyone know why they make RVSM operator specific as opposed to airworthiness specific?

 

[Fly91]

All,
Forgive my ignorance. My first time taking delivery of a new aircraft and awaiting approval of our RVSM LOA. Does anyone have any experience with getting clearance from ATC to climb through RVSM to take advantage of altitudes above 410? If so are than any particular ways to request this on the flight plan? Taking delivery next week and really don't want to be stuck low for up to 60 days. Local FSDO is already expecting us and the HMU flight is being accomplished on delivery day.

Thanks for your input!

Very easy to do.................I flew contract for an air ambulance company for a couple years...maybe did 50 flights in two years. Each and every time we climbed through, in and above RVSM airspace. Both planes were NOT RVSM certified and still are not and they still fly in RVSM airspace today just like everyone else does.

Just put "Negative RVSM" in the remarks section of the flight plan....then you MUST tell each ATC controller that you get handed off to that you are Negative RVSM (only while in RVSM airspace boundaries) on your initial call up to that controller. Thats it.

I would say, from memory, 2-3 times in two years did we ever get a delay of any kind and maybe 3-4 times while crusing, IN RVSM airspace, we were asked to make slight turn to accommodate other RVSM traffic.

Also....we just did it recently about 8 trips from Florida to Hew Hamshire....awaiting our new LOA. We operated 100% identical......climbed into RVSM normally like we always do, had zero turns or hold downs......we flew to-and-from New Hamshire like nothing changed. Even up in the NE...it was all normal flying.

 

[bizjet800]

Very easy to do.................I flew contract for an air ambulance company for a couple years...maybe did 50 flights in two years. Each and every time we climbed through, in and above RVSM airspace. Both planes were NOT RVSM certified and still are not and they still fly in RVSM airspace today just like everyone else does.

Just put "Negative RVSM" in the remarks section of the flight plan....then you MUST tell each ATC controller that you get handed off to that you are Negative RVSM (only while in RVSM airspace boundaries) on your initial call up to that controller. Thats it.

I would say, from memory, 2-3 times in two years did we ever get a delay of any kind and maybe 3-4 times while crusing, IN RVSM airspace, we were asked to make slight turn to accommodate other RVSM traffic.

Also....we just did it recently about 8 trips from Florida to Hew Hamshire....awaiting our new LOA. We operated 100% identical......climbed into RVSM normally like we always do, had zero turns or hold downs......we flew to-and-from New Hamshire like nothing changed. Even up in the NE...it was all normal flying.

Doesn't air ambulance enjoy a special exemption?

 

[landlover]

Doesn't air ambulance enjoy a special exemption?

yes they do

 

[gern_blanston]

Does anyone know why they make RVSM operator specific as opposed to airworthiness specific?

Great question. The LOA program is bizarre; has to be based on what the Europeans insist on to employ a few hundred additional EASA drones.
RVSM training in 8 seconds:
Don't hand fly above 28,000 feet, always stay on your assigned altitude, and make sure your aircraft is RVSM certified.
It should be that simple.

 

[AgreenFO]

Flew freight all the time in 35's that were NON-RVSM, Air ambulance or not you will be able to get to 430 just about every time. I think there was one time we couldn't, but it was a short flight anyway. Just make sure you check the temps up high and make sure you are light enough to not only get there but get there quick. Nothing seems worse for a controller than a NON-RVSM aircraft inching it's way through crowded RVSM airspace. Good luck.

 

[pilothouston123]

Why is RVSM required for new operators or N number change? Pilot training required and The FAA says so...
Flying Neg RVSM is no big deal if you stay out of the NE. Change equipment suffix add NEG RVSM in remarks and take it to the sky. and state NEG rvsm on radio when passing through. You will not be able to level off in RVSM anywhere unless there is a need from controlling agency. it's a little bit of a hassle and

 

[swamprat]

Thanks for all the input. Took delivery of the airplane and have had no trouble climbing through RVSM so far!!!

 

[Iflewjetz]

I know you wouldnt do it, but make sure you dont fly/file in RVSM without the LOA. When we were getting approval for the LOA last year, we had a few trips on the plane. We filed low, but requested climb through RVSM and always got it. When I went to pick up the LOA, the inspector said, "you guys sure have been flying alot lately." So, my next order of business was to contact NBAA and have my plane blocked!

 

[gern_blanston]

You do realize that that'll keep us from seeing, but not your POI.

 

[swamprat]

New twist on the RVSM bs. We haven't had any problems getting clearance above RVSM airspace so far but have a trip scheduled to Cabo San Lucas this week. Im guessing the same would apply in Mexico especially since you spend so much time in non radar environment. Planning to file for FL280 and request FL430 enroute. Anybody out there had issues with this in Mexico?

 

[Sandhawk]

Great question. The LOA program is bizarre; has to be based on what the Europeans insist on to employ a few hundred additional EASA drones.
RVSM training in 8 seconds:
Don't hand fly above 28,000 feet, always stay on your assigned altitude, and make sure your aircraft is RVSM certified.
It should be that simple.

Don't forget to reduce your rate of climb / descent to 1,000fpm or less for the last 1,000 ft prior to level-off....

 

[spxdriver]

New twist on the RVSM bs. We haven't had any problems getting clearance above RVSM airspace so far but have a trip scheduled to Cabo San Lucas this week. Im guessing the same would apply in Mexico especially since you spend so much time in non radar environment. Planning to file for FL280 and request FL430 enroute. Anybody out there had issues with this in Mexico?

Are you flying from the US to Cabo San Lucas? If so, you won't be spending any time outside of radar contact on that flight.

I have heard, on numerous occasions, Mexico ATC denying aircraft higher than FL280 when they're non-RVSM.

 

[SabreFlyR]

Are you flying from the US to Cabo San Lucas? If so, you won't be spending any time outside of radar contact on that flight.

I have heard, on numerous occasions, Mexico ATC denying aircraft higher than FL280 when they're non-RVSM.

Especially if your crossing from South Texas, it's will soon be very busy along those routes.

 

[big pimpn']

I fly a ce-560 contract on a regular basis and transition through RVSM to 430 - 450, it's a nobrainer and easy to do... Just make sure u have the required equipment suffix and don't accept a level off at RVSM altitudes and u will b fine

 

[BoilerUP]

None of this would be an issue if the FAA didn't allow FSDOs to have their heads up their asses when it comes to issuing RVSM OpSpecs in a timely manner.

The day we took delivery of our CJ2+, I got a call from our FSDO saying they needed a copy of the temp registration so they could issue; one single fax page from Cessna and I had the OpSpecs in hand before signing the delivery papers.

On a previous aircraft, it was 16 total days from FSDO receiving our manuals until I picked up the paperwork.

Every time I read some operator taking 3-6 MONTHS to get an LOA I can't help but shake my head...