ASA rumor

[ASADriver]

There is a rumor floating around the airport that we will have more meetings in May. Why hasn't ALPA said anything yet?

 

[Texx]

There is a rumor floating around the airport that we will have more meetings in May. Why hasn't ALPA said anything yet?

Because as you stated "it's a rumor."

 

[JoeMerchant]

Because as you stated "it's a rumor."

I suspect ALPA is just trying to figure out how to "spin" it..... It is a fact, just waiting for the spin....

 

[sweptback]

Given that the company seems just as eager to post any bit of info, and given that we haven't heard anything from either side, could it be possible that this rumor has no truth to it?

 

[JoeMerchant]

Given that the company seems just as eager to post any bit of info, and given that we haven't heard anything from either side, could it be possible that this rumor has no truth to it?

And if it's true, how are you going to defend the delay in passing the info along....

 

[AMANSWORLD]

Is it possible ASA is a sh!thole and the pilot group needs to do something about it.

 

[av8er2]

ASA pilot group won't do anything.

 

[JoeMerchant]

ASA pilot group won't do anything.

You're right, we have created a system where these are "stepping stone" jobs. Why would a pilot risk anything when they don't plan on staying.....

Is there a plan B?????

 

[JoeMerchant]

Is it possible ASA is a sh!thole and the pilot group needs to do something about it.

So are you in the process of leaving? What are YOU doing?

 

[sweptback]

And if it's true, how are you going to defend the delay in passing the info along....

Why do I have to defend it? It's not like I have anything to do with the union and their communications!

All I'm saying is, if there was truth to this rumor, one side would have announced it by now. My uneducated hunch is that we haven't heard anything yet, although I would welcome more negotiation sessions. We can't get the deal done if we're not talking!

 

[buscap]

Why do I have to defend it? It's not like I have anything to do with the union and their communications!

All I'm saying is, if there was truth to this rumor, one side would have announced it by now. My uneducated hunch is that we haven't heard anything yet, although I would welcome more negotiation sessions. We can't get the deal done if we're not talking!

The fact is we can't get a deal if we are talking.

This is not 1998.

A deal will happen when we are not talking. A deal will happen when our respective backs are against a wall.

 

[JoeMerchant]

The fact is we can't get a deal if we are talking.

This is not 1998.

A deal will happen when we are not talking. A deal will happen when our respective backs are against a wall.

Your absolutely right this isn't 1998.

If we don't get a release, what is our next move? Is there a plan B? What if it is only OUR side that is against a wall......... then what?

 

[601Pilot]

Your absolutely right this isn't 1998.

If we don't get a release, what is our next move? Is there a plan B? What if it is only OUR side that is against a wall......... then what?

We provide a little CHAOS from our side; I can't believe you actually asked that question! Unfortunately, I know you are too scared to rock the boat; you actually need this job.

 

[JoeMerchant]

We provide a little CHAOS from our side; I can't believe you actually asked that question! Unfortunately, I know you are too scared to rock the boat; you actually need this job.

Never happen again 601.... most regional pilots are just passing thru..... I participated in '98, and tried again in 2001 during the CMR strike.... no support anymore... deal with the reality we have created for ourselves rather than living in the past..... I don't "need" this job, but I am smart enough not to just give it up for some mythical union "brotherhood".... There won't be a strike, and there won't be a '98 campaign... now what 601....

 

[601Pilot]

Never happen again 601.... most regional pilots are just passing thru..... I participated in '98, and tried again in 2001 during the CMR strike.... no support anymore... deal with the reality we have created for ourselves rather than living in the past..... I don't "need" this job, but I am smart enough not to just give it up for some mythical union "brotherhood".... There won't be a strike, and there won't be a '98 campaign... now what 601....

Well John, just give up and sit on the sidelines ranting your anti-ALPA rhetoric. I'll keep doing what I'm doing until either I'm fired or we get our contract done. Hopefully some others will join me.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Well John, just give up and sit on the sidelines ranting your anti-ALPA rhetoric. I'll keep doing what I'm doing until either I'm fired or we get our contract done. Hopefully some others will join me.

OK, I will... enjoy your battle.... I tried that during the CMR stike when we flew CMR passengers in CMR airplanes... Didn't work...Don't suppose you want to reform ALPA so that we actually confront management as a single group now..... never mind, you are probably afraid to confront ALPA.... we can't speak bad about ALPA now can we.....

Let me know how your battle goes.... wasn't it you that said you don't have any respect for the ASA pilots....

 

[AMANSWORLD]

So are you in the process of leaving? What are YOU doing?

I am gone simply because I have found a better oppurtunity with positive leadership in both management and labor. ASA management and ALPA are 100% unaccountable and the only people that pay for it are those trying to better themselves or a situation.

BTW have fun with the 200 hour prodigy pilots.

 

[HarryParatestes]

Both sides are dragging their collective feet.

 

[ASARJMan]

I suspect ALPA is just trying to figure out how to "spin" it..... It is a fact, just waiting for the spin....

But you beat ALPA to it Joey haven't you!

Joey, the self-interest and self-impressed with himself spin master!
(In his mind of course).

 

[ASARJMan]

..... I don't "need" this job, but I am smart enough not to just give it up for some mythical union "brotherhood".... ..

You sure YOU don't need this job JB? What with all your mortgages (boat, beach condo, mountain joint, house in Sharpsburg etc) one would think YOU and your gf BOTH need your jobs!

 

[737 Pylt]

I suspect ALPA is just trying to figure out how to "spin" it..... It is a fact, just waiting for the spin....

So John, how does the rjdc spin it?

737

 

[Richard Gozinya]

It is a fact,

FACT???????? The only thing that is accepted as truth in this world without facts is global warming.

What is your source????

Dick

 

["GO AROUND"]

I'm trying to move on to better things just like 2/3rds of the pilots at ASA. Until that happens I will support a fair contract for ASA pilots.

 

[flylowman]

no support anymore... deal with the reality we have created for ourselves[/COLOR]


No support. Looks like you are giving alot of support. Why do you want to undermine our union? Yes you are a part also. We are in tuff times now and need everyone to step up. The only way to "deal with the reality we have created for ourselves", is get this thing over, get some scope, and put this whole ugly mess behind us.

Everyone needs to fly the contract. Stop all this whining on the radio. It makes me sick, and it should you also.

 

[~~~^~~~]

So John, how does the rjdc spin it?

737

737 Pylt: Why bring the RJDC into this? What relevance is there?

I think your side won the RJDC conflict. There are seven different DCI Carriers in Atlanta, the ASA pilots no longer have the negotiating capital to obtain a leading contract and are beginning to learn just how ALPA's action to lock them out of Delta's scope has effected their situation. We are being replaced by non union pilots - you have won, Sir.

The RJDC will likely win their lawsuit. But for folks like me who support the cause of a more inclusive union that brings pilots together, we have lost. I'm finding other work despite the fact that I had always hoped that ASA and Comair pilots would be able to negotiate contracts which would make their current position flying Delta passengers a job worthy of a professional pilot.

The RJDC has had a positive effect. ALPA was restrained from some of their more predatory inclinations on the Delta property. We are in less of a mess than our similarly situated brothers who do business with US Air and North West. ASA's MEC has been fully funded and recieved support from ALPA National to the extent that they remained clear of conflicts with the Delta MEC.

John is not a plaintiff. He is a patriot in the custom of Ben Franklin who also wrote extensively about the causes of his time. Much of what he writes might be unpopular - but - are we not in the exact position that he said we would be in eight years ago when ALPA decided its' Merger and Fragmentation policies were only applicable to a separate, preferred, class of ALPA member?

We need one ALPA and One Level of Representation. The deep divisions in our union have grown into chasms which become more difficult to bridge with every member who has forgotten that the basic tenent of unionism is to bring people together to improve a profession.

The Delta pilots gave up their most recent scope concessions in exchange for "bargaining credits" which I believe were evaluated by ALPA at $160,000,000. These bargaining credits had a cost. The ASA pilots are paying that cost:

1. There are fewer mainline Delta jobs as a result of these CRJ900's and E-Jets for ASA guys & gals to apply for.
2. Some of the CRJ900's were taken straight from ASA's book of firm orders None of this flying is being performed by ASA pilots.
3. ASA pilots are being replaced by non union pilots performing this flying
4. Delta complains that DCI service is tarnishing the Widget while the DCI carriers beat the ever living snot out of each other trying to underbid each other for Delta's Requests for Proposals. You can have high quality, or cheap. Comair had a high quality product. They have been destroyed. Mesa on the other hand continues to grow their business with Delta as fast as they can.

You won, we lost. The Plaintiffs will probably get something for their trouble. The rest of us will try to find jobs.

In the mean while the RJDC is the only voice speaking for the necessary reforms to keep ALPA viable into this century. They still have my support and if hired at a mainline carrier, I will continue to support the idea of a union that brings together and represents all of its members.

~~~^~~~

 

[701EV]

Fin's

You are SO right!

Maybe we can dream that one day ALPA will wake up and smell the coffee

701EV

 

[DrunkIrishman]

John is not a plaintiff. He is a patriot in the custom of Ben Franklin who also wrote extensively about the causes of his time.

I just threw up in my mouth a little bit.

When John invents something useful someday, I'll agree with that statement. Until that day, you're nucking futs Fins.

 

[ohplease!]

737 Pylt: Why bring the RJDC into this? What relevance is there?

because he's too simple minded to bring up anything useful or relevant.....by the way, does anyone know if I can put the idiot on ignore even when you guy's quote him? I've put him on ignore but, occasionally I still have to witness the train wreck that has become 737POS.....

 

[scarlet]

Oh please--get a life---you know only way to have job sec. is be with Skywest---I vote for ONE LIST, does well for Republic, Freedumb/Mesa*s

 

[~~~^~~~]

I just threw up in my mouth a little bit.

When John invents something useful someday, I'll agree with that statement.

Ok, OK, I reached a little far with that one... like way over the top.

It was a reference to using the written word to help shape a debate. Ben Franklin used his time to fule the debate as to whether the Rattle Snake, the Turkey, or the Bald Eagle were appropriate symbols for the US. Ben was in favor of the snake or the turkey over the Bald Eagle - hey every body misses one every once in a while.