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CFI's: Don't think of the job as just a timebuilder

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HAL

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 26, 2001
Posts
733
At the risk of starting some flames, if you are or have been a CFI, read the article in this link:

http://flighttraining.aopa.org/cfi_tools/publications/inst_reports2.cfm?article=5262

It says a lot about what many young people coming out of the 'RJ factory' type of flight school are like when they apply for CFI positions.

A brief excerpt:

... (She) had graduated 12 months earlier from Big Name Flight School with minimum hours, no teaching practice, and no actual flight time in clouds. But, as I gently tried to explain to her, that's not why she didn't land a job with my flight school here in Kentucky. Any blame for that should be laid directly on her instructors and the flight school for which they worked.

The article doesn't accuse the 'big name' flight schools of turning out bad pilots, but rather pilots that because of the airline focused ciriculum don't know that much about flying small planes, and the rules that govern them. And also remember; if you are going to these schools expecting to move right into an RJ, then a few years later into a 737, you might be right. Then again, with the way airlines operate in cycles, you might be furloughed from that 737 into a single-pilot job flying a Navajo in Alaska. Now what do you do? You don't know the first thing about single-pilot flying, or general aviation. You've hardly any time at all below the flight levels. Are you really equipped to do this? Or teach it?

I know a lot of people look at being a CFI as just a timebuilder job on the way to the airlines. But for just a minute, think about the people that are being taught by these CFI's. Is their training the best it can be? Do you as a CFI bring the best available knowlege to their lessons? Do you have their interests first in line instead of padding your logbook? Would you want to share the skies with them after their checkride? Do you have the knowledge and ability to be a competent CFI?

I was a CFI for several years before moving on to the airlines and found that despite the low pay and long hours, being a CFI can be an immensely rewarding job if you put your students first. But above all you must be ready to learn yourself what it takes to be a good pilot. You teach it over and over every day, and that will make you one of the best pilots possible. But if you don't know it to begin with, how can you pass it on to your students?

HAL
 
So I'm goin to ATP at GKY, Hopefully CFI/MEI by next next Thanksgiving.

My buddy working the line at GKY with a commmercial license said the ATP guys won't let the students fly through the clouds. Even while working on the instrument lic.

Is this a pipe dream?

AllATP: all done by next winter 05'
CFI: for a year 06'
Get on w/SkyWest or a twin turbo prop cargo in TX (yeah they're different, but WTF?)
FedEx: Eight years from now FE at FedEx. (Finally starting my career at a bada$$ company)

BTW, my buddy flying rj's as a capt says those (academy) guys can fly the heck out of a jet.

but, once checklists come out, they say what to do, but do not actually do the action....press the button or switch the knob....CRM??????????

CAPT has looked numerous times and realized the FO from the academy has not switched the actual switch.

I don't know $hit...just a low time guy loooking for answers; and is ATP a good place to learn from?
 
I can't really argue with a whole lot of things in that article.
A "Kathy" came to see us (me) for a job about 4 months ago.
Clueless but 120 hrs CRJ sim in her logbook.
In all fairness, she did say she was only looking for temporary employment since she was a graduate from "Blah Blah" and she expected to be hired with a regional with 500hrs TT.
Needless to say not impressed.
 
I just had a phone interview with ATP yesterday and was offered a position working with their CFI program (or so I was told) starting after June. I, for one, am not one of those guys who signs a student off at the first sign of competency...guess we'll see how I fit in.

I've known pilots who came out of ATP as some of the best pilots I've seen, and also some of the worst. They can fly, they just don't know their s---. You've got to have the knowledge base to make it as an instructor. I read the CFI report when I got it in the mail a week or so ago...the fact that she just finished her 'fast-track' program and FAILED a basic private pilot test is pathetic.

Tex- As far as not flying in the clouds, I noticed this as well when I was there, but I'm not sure that it's an ATP policy per se. I'll have an answer to that in a few months...

-buckI
 
I love how people with thousands of hours tell other pilots that they need to be the best CFIs they can be. I fully agree that pilot mills focused on jets at 100 hours are a bad thing, but let's not forget that being a CFI sucks, sucks, sucks.

I remember my wife crying in the grocery store because we didn't have enough money to eat, again. I remember working 6 days a week to make less than $1000 a month. I remember driving all the way out to the hangar, only to have the guy be a no-show. I remember eating one bowl of cereal for breakfast, and one can of Chunky's soup for lunch everyday, because it added up to less than $2.50. I remember not having any insurance.

I had some great experiences too, but like remembering an old girlfriend, lots of you fellow airline pilots quickly forget the bad.
 
Tex said:
My buddy working the line at GKY with a commmercial license said the ATP guys won't let the students fly through the clouds. Even while working on the instrument lic.

anyone currently at ATP care to chime in on this i.e. no actual?

thanks
 
labbats said:
I love how people with thousands of hours tell other pilots that they need to be the best CFIs they can be. I fully agree that pilot mills focused on jets at 100 hours are a bad thing, but let's not forget that being a CFI sucks, sucks, sucks.

I remember my wife crying in the grocery store because we didn't have enough money to eat, again. I remember working 6 days a week to make less than $1000 a month. I remember driving all the way out to the hangar, only to have the guy be a no-show. I remember eating one bowl of cereal for breakfast, and one can of Chunky's soup for lunch everyday, because it added up to less than $2.50. I remember not having any insurance.

I had some great experiences too, but like remembering an old girlfriend, lots of you fellow airline pilots quickly forget the bad.

I agree, great experiences but I hope that when I instruct again(because it was a h*ll of a lot of fun) that it is on my own accord and done as a second job to flying for the airlines. Sitting in the instructor lounge for 80-100 hours a week only to fly 10-20 waiting on weather, students or both does indeed suck, suck, suck!
 
In Atlanta, they definitely fly in IMC

When I did my training at ATP in Atlanta, it was all in actual IMC. In fact, my ATP check ride was in actual as well.
 
I instructed 3 years before getting another job. The only thing that saved me was being single and living at home. The money (as we all know) sucked. I was at the airport 15 hrs. a day, 6-7 days a week (hence the single part). To me it was a time builder, certainly not a money maker. Had some enjoyable times, and a bunch of "why the F#@! do I do this." I enjoy flying tremendously, but I need money and a life also.

The one positive is that I met many, many great people that I still talk with to this day.
 

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